Robin’s Rambles: Supernatural 8.03 – Heartache
Heartache
Season 8 Episode 3
Robin’s Rambles by Robin Vogel
Minneapolis, MN – A handsome jogger is overtaken by a more portly jogger. The former congratulates the latter on passing him. The plump jogger says, “I do a lot of cardio,” reaches into the other man’s chest and removes his heart, killing him. The handsome jogger drops down dead.
Sam takes a juicy red apple from a basket and bites into it. Dean, citing the jogger’s gruesome death, remarks how hell broke loose while he was in Purgatory. “Six months ago, same thing happens, also in Minneapolis,what does that tell us?” “Stay out of that state,” suggests Sam, paying for the fruits and veggies he bought. Dean wants to jump on this case, but Sam reminds him they ARE on a case,finding Kevin and the demon tablet,heart guy takes a number. They’ve spent a week searching for Kevin, and they’re. . .where the hell? “Farmer’s market,” Sam says, “Organic,I had a year off, took time to enjoy the good things.” “While avoiding doing what we actually do,” niggles Dean. “Does it make you feel better every time you say it?” Sam asks. “I get it,you took a year off to do Yoga and play the lute,whatever,” says Dean, “but we’re back, and we walk and kill monsters at the same time,we’ll find Kevin, but are innocent people supposed to die so you can shop for produce?”
They consult with local law enforcement, who tell them the guy’s heart was ripped from him like a peach pit. No robbery, no enemies. The incident six months ago, brick wall. He shows them a film of park surveillance. “Chubby guy last person to see the vic alive? “Dean asks. “Other than the killer,that’s Paul Hayes, we pulled him in for questioning,” the cop says,”No reason not to think he’s clean,they did a thorough check, not so much as a parking ticket,look at him, Thor he ain’t,forgive me if I didn’t take him out back and shoot him.” “Any idea where we can find this guy?” Sam asks.
Paul Hayes is mixing himself a nutrition shake when Sam comes to call. Sam asks if he spoke with the guy he passed who was later killed. “Didn’t know him, ran passed him, never saw him again, the end,” says Paul, who dubs his drink disgusting, “but keeps you young.” “Too much fiber,” declares Dean. “No such thing,” says Paul. “The jogger you outraced was a good deal younger than you,” says Sam. “Less full figured,” notes Dean. “You should have seen me before,” says Paul, “hugging a desk all day, watching TV all night, eatin fried everything, was killin me, I had a health scare about a year ago,changed my life, I started taking care of myself,my body’s a temple where I worship everyday.” He takes another slug of his drink and Dean grimaces.
Later, Dean reports finding only condoms and hair gel at Paul’s, no hex bags or anything satanic, but they find another heart removal, two days after this one, in Ames, IA. “Paul was here being questioned, it couldn’t have been him. This guy was a cop, exactly what happened six months ago, Minneapolis, then Ames,guessed you missed that one,just sayin’.”
Officer Swenson, top cop on the force, reports the cop,he ordered a pizza which the vic delivered,and didn’t make it to his next drop-off,his body was found on the walk next to Swenson’s,heartless–Swenson crumpled on the front stoop, cryin’ like a baby,he had been in court all week, testifying. “So that couldn’t have been him in Minneapolis,” Sam murmurs to Dean, who says, “I hate when this happens.” So, says Dean, what does this Arthur guy have to say? Not very helpful, the cop reports.
Sam sits across from Arthur, who is wringing his hands and muttering in tongues. He repeating something, and his eyes are mad. “Did you do this alone?” Dean asks. “Did some invisible voice tell you you had to kill?” Sam asks. Arthur bangs on the table with his fists. Dean pours holy water on Arthur’s arm,nothing. “Why did you do this?” Dean asks. Arthur just mumbles the same thing.
Later, alone in his cell, Arthur pries free a metal bar from his bed. It appears that he plants it between his eyes. We hear a terrible scream.
Sam plays back Arthur’s blather and asks Dean what he thinks. “I prefer Keith Richards’ version,” quips Dean,”sounds like babble to me,wait a second, I bought a translation app.” “You bought an app?” Sam asks, surprised. It comes up language unknown, however. Sam’s phone rings; he answers Agent Samborra.
They race back to find that Arthur removed his eye, severed his optic nerve, using part of his bed frame as a knife. He had two different colored eyes; he was in an accident and one was replaced; he cut out the transplanted eye. Dean wants to know if it’s possible to find the donor of the transplanted organ. “Difficult, but not impossible,” she says.
Motel room – Sam reveals that Paul Hayes had a transplant, too,a heart. Sam thinks Arthur was speaking in a dead language, like Ancient Greek or Manx? So Sam emailed an audio file of Arthur’s mumbling to Dr. Morrison. Dean says they have to go to Boulder Colorado for the next “heart attack.”
Outside the Bunny Hole – Randa meets Chuck, who praises her performance tonight,must take years of training. “I’m kind of a natural,” she coos, linking her arm in his and walking away. “I don’t normally do this thing,” he says, “there’s something about you.” She shoves him against the wall and reaches into his chest (through his shirt!) for his heart. He falls down next to a garbage can in a filthy alley.
Driving, Dean says things are coming together, you and me. When Sam doesn’t respond, Dean asks, “What are you thinkin about, organic tomatoes?” “I’m not thinking about anything,” Sam says. “I don’t know about you,”” Dean says, but this last year has given me a new perspective.” “I hear you,” Sam says. “I know where I’m at my best,” Dean says, “right here, drivin down crazy street, next to you.” (Awwwww!) “Makes sense,” says Sam, without conviction. “Yes it does,” says Dean. “Or, maybe you don’t need me,” suggests Sam, “maybe you’re at your best hacking and slicing your way through the world’s crap alone, not having to explain yourself to anybody.” “Yeah, that makes sense,” says Dean, “seeing as I have SO many brothers I can talk to about this stuff.” “Look,” says Sam, “I’m not saying I’m bailing on you, I’m just saying make room for the possibility we want different things,I mean I want my time to count for something.” “So what we do doesn’t count?” Dean demands. The phone rings,Dr. Kashi. Dean asks her to run one more name for him,”Paul Hayes. . .and the donor. . .really?–how many others?–did anybody from Boulder, Colorado receive any of those organs?–okay, thank you. She says that both Paul Henson’s kidney and Arthur Swenson’s new eye came from,you ready for this,Brick Holmes.” “You don’t mean THE Brick Holmes?” Sam asks,”the all-pro quarterback?” “The guy played at the top of his game for like a million years,” says Dean. “He bought it in a car crash last year,” says Sam, “nose-dived off a bridge or something,must’ve signed a donor card,the doctor say how many organs he donated?” “Including our two suspects?” Dean asks,”Eight. Brick lived just outside of Boulder,” says Dean, “so that’s where we’re going.”
Randa dips her fingers in a bowl of blood and wipes it on her face, speaking in the same language we heard Paul speaking. She holds a heart in both hands and bites into it. (Ewwww, gross!) Smoke envelopes and fills her, and the area where her heart is glows red. Her eyes glow red, too.
Sam and Dean, suited up, express their condolences to Brick Holmes’ mother. Sam speaks of his football career reverently and how he never slowed down. “Brick lived for competition and athletic perfection,” she agrees, “but it didn’t occur to his fans that he was human, like the rest of us.” “Did you know your son was an organ donor?” Sam asks. “Does that make this an FBI matter?” She asks. “We’re here to dot some i’s on a different matter,” Dean says. “There was a public awareness thing a few years ago,” she says, “I’m sure Brick didn’t think twice, just signed on because he never thought he was going to die.” “A lot of jocks are like that,” agrees Dean. “I can’t help but wonder, what happened that night on that bridge,light traffic, no alcohol, no skid marks, big time athlete, reflexes like a cat, how is it that he just drives off the side of a bridge?” “When things happen that aren’t supposed to happen,” she says, “they’re called accidents, I believe.” “Everybody knows about Brick’s football career,” says Sam, “but no one knows much about his personal life,was he ever married?” “Just to the game,he gave it everything he had,” she says, “It’s a difficult life.” “Did you notice any changes in Brick before he died?” Dean asks. “Anyone, anything new in his life?” “I don’t think so,” she replies. “No new hobbies,” Dean asks, “stamp collecting, the occult?” “The occult?” She repeats, “Everything was just as it had been, rising, I’m sorry, but my time is up,the university is naming a new building after Brick, I can’t be late.” Sam has one more question. “There is always one more question, that’s what I find,” she says, walking away.
Outside, Sam sourly notes that she didn’t want to say much. “Son of a bitch,” says Dean, looking at his phone. Someone else had a heart tipped out in Boulder. Watching them drive away from the window, Brick’s mother sees Randa on the stairs. “What are you doing here?” Brick’s mom asks her. “You know I like to stay close to the mother ship,” Randa replies, “saw a car out front, so I came in the back,cops?” “I suppose Brick’s death continues to fascinate,” comments Mom. “So we’re clear,you’re still being very careful about what you say?” Randa asks. “I’m old, not an idiot,” says Mom. “I’m just trying to protect Brick,” says Randa. “So am I,” says Mama. “Brick’s heart beats inside here now,” says Randa, pointing to her chest, “Brick gave me new life, I can feel him!–it’s why I moved to Boulder,to be near here,and I’ll watch out for you like Brick did.” “I don’t need your concern,” says Mom. “We need each other!” insists Randa, “and Brick needs us,you keep our little secret safe, and the three of us will be just fine.”
Hotel room – Sam, on the phone with Professor Morrison, thanks him and says he is totally looking into him as a consultant for the FBI (and it comes with a medical plan). “Here’s what crazy Swenson was babbling over and over,it’s a dead language, Ancient Mayan, the divine god Kakau is born. The Mayan god of maize,corn was the most important thing to the Mayans,that and torturing and killing everything in sight.” “We better cap this god quick, or someone in Phoenix is next to get his heart tipped out,” reports Dean. “Someone in Phoenix got a piece of Brick?” Sam asks. There’s another email for Sam,about college admissions,is Sam seriously considering hanging it up? “I’m just looking at options,” Sam insists,”so, we just go to Phoenix and chase our tails until this guy shows his face?” “No,” says Dean, “Eleanor Holmes is doing her darndest not to tell us a thing,nice job changing the subject, though.”
The brothers break into the Holmes house that night, flashlights at the ready. They check the closets. Dean muses what the stuff in Brick’s closet would go for on eBay. He asks Sam if it would crush him to know his boy wasn’t a natural blond. In Brick’s room, Sam wonders if he’s found Eleanor’s closet, including the outfit she was wearing the day they talked to her. “Maybe she moved into Brick’s room after he died,” suggests Dean, or. . . They look at the big bed. “That image is permanently etched into my retinas,” bitches Sam, making a face. Dean finds a secret door in the back of his closet. “That’s what I’m talkin about,” he says. Sam follows him in. There is, as Dean says, a lot of hardware,race car driving, balls, bats, trophies, baseball stuff, boxing, awards, etc. “He was a fan,” realized Sam, “any kind of sport, he respected ’em, look at all the old stuff he’s got,cricket mallet, golf clubs, canoe sword, archery equipment.” They find letters addressed to “Dearest Betsy.” There’s one indicating a bout with Sugar Ray Robinson, signed Love, Me. Letters, about him versing the Phillies, the Dodgers, Red Sox. The latest? Dear Betsy, So tired of it all. . . Sam pulls up the named of those trophies,Brick Holmes, football player, Charlie Carnes, race car driver, Davey Samuelson, baseball player, Kelly Durand, Boxer,four different guys, right? “Check this out – same dark eyes, same cheek bones, nose, mouth.” “Are you saying that these four guys, all who look to be in their mid twenties and go back 70 years are the same guy?” Dean asks, “Wow!–for 95, Brick Holmes sure could take a hit.”
“So,” says Sam, “if all those athletes were the same guy, how did he pull it off? Appear, the go away and come back with a new look?” “The Mayan were all about torture, war and sports,” says Dean. “It says their athletes were treated like kings, the Mayan jocks made sacrifices to Kacow by killing a victim, pulling out his heart and eating, they believed the rituals gave them super-charged power over their opponents. But they didn’t stay young forever,” Sam points out, “so, what, Brick made some kind of deal with this Kacow?” “We’ve seen it before,” Dean reminds him, “people making deals with demons, gods, maybe he stayed young and strong so long as the sacrifices kept coming, remember all that antique sports equipment he had?–this guy could go back to the Mayan days.” “Wow,” says Sam, “so one of the greatest QBs to ever play the game was over 900 years old.” “That explains Brick,” says Dean, “but what about the mooks carrying his spare parts?” “Maybe the spell went along for the ride,” suggests Sam, and “infected the people who got his organs,remember how Paul said he had a health scare that changed his life?–maybe the spell could compel him to keep on carrying out the ritual.” “So it’s like being bit by a werewolf,” says Dean, “once you’re infected, you do what you gotta do, especially if you like the results.” “Right,” says Sam, “except old Arthur, the dedicated cop, couldn’t handle it and went nuts. Brick Holmes, a heart-eater, who knew?” “Sorry, buddy,” says Dean, “the mighty, they fall hard.” “At least he wasn’t sleeping with his mother,” says Sam. (LMAO!) “Yeah, good, Sam, find the silver lining,” says Dean sarcastically. “No, seriously, look,” urges Sam, turning the screen to show Dean. There is a picture of the fighter with Dearest Betsy, a stunning blond.
Later, the Holmes residence – “Hello, Eleanor,” Dean greets her, “or would you rather we call you Betsy?” They tell her all. “Innocent people are dying,” reveals Sam, “and they’re going to continue to die until we stop it.” “Did you know about the murders over the past year?” Dean asks. “I didn’t, I swear,” she says, “I thought when Brick died, it would be over.” “Help us,” pleads Dean, “this is not what you want Brick’s legacy to be.” “His Mayan name was Enyo,” she says, “He was a proud young athlete nearly a thousand years ago,he lived for sport and never wanted his days in the sun to end,so he arranged a bargain with the god Kacow, the high priest.” “To stay young forever,” guesses Dean. “As long as the sacrifices continued,” she says, “twice a year, once for the planting, once for the harvest.” “When did you find out about this?” Sam asks. “Not until I began to age and Brick,Kelly as he was when I met him,did not,but by that time, Brick himself had changed, inside,he wasn’t just the warrior whose only reason for living was combat, we were deeply, deeply in love, so in love I’m ashamed to say that when I found out how my husband stayed young and strong, I chose to ignore it.” “You and Brick had to go underground from time to time to hide your secret, right?” says Sam. “Every 10 years or so,” she says, “he would re-emerge with a new look or a new name and me, I was the wife and the woman in hiding, and when I got into my 40’s, I became Brick’s mother., Eleanor,I am so tired, you can’t imagine the burden of it all,I think even Brick was through,he could see the end of my days was at hand and he had lived centuries all alone,but I don’t think he could bear the thought of life without me,that’s why he drove off that bridge,you must think I’m a monster.” They all look sad. “No,” says Dean, “just that you married one,here’s the deal,now there are eight killers out there that we have to deal with, not just one.” “I don’t think so,” says Eleanor. “What?” Sam says, exchanging a look with Dean, “why not?” “Brick used to say the heart was key,” Eleanor says, “that was the focus of the sacrifice.” “Are you saying if we stop Brick’s beating heart,” says Dean, “then we can stop the whole thing?” She nods. “Do you know where the person is who has the heart?” Sam asks. She doesn’t respond, and Sam repeats his question, more vehemently. “DO YOU KNOW?”
Bunny Hole – The Impala pulls up. “Really?–our King Daddy Monster is a stripper?” Dean asks. “We’re pretty sure this is going to work, right?” Sam asks. “Well,” says Dean, pulling something from his duffel, “as long as Eleanor knows what she’s talking about.” (But can they trust her?) He hands a vicious looking knife to Sam, who asks, “Do you think Brick thought maybe he’d burn to nothing when he crashed that car?” “Yeah,” answers Dean, “but he didn’t, which brings us here.” They break into the dark dance club; out with the flashlights. “Smell that?” Exults Dean. “You’re gross,” remarks Sam.
They walk up two flights of stairs to the stage. Randa comes out. “Eleanor sent you, right?” She asks, “figured she’d probably break and give me up,this won’t end well for her, of course,not that it’s gonna end well for YOU.” Sam pulls out his knife. Randa says, “You don’t think we’re gonna let you do that, do you?” “WE?” Dean repeats. Paul and an Oriental man come out and begin beating on the brothers. Two hold Dean down. “You guys are stronger than you look,” says Dean. “Comes with the package,” says Paul, “plus, I work out a lot.” Randa stands over Dean and says, “You can’t imagine who I was before,this shy, awkward little thing from Georgia with a heart condition,then I had the surgery.” She steps on his chest, and Dean gasps. “I became freakin Xena, Warrior Princess,she sits on him,I couldn’t dissect a frog in high school,sacrificing to Kacow, better than sex,she peels apart Dean’s shirt and begins making circles on his t-shirt,so if I go real slow, take my time and enjoy this, I can actually show you your own beating heart before you die.” She plunges her nails against his chest, drawing blood, making him gasp in pain. Sam tosses something at Paul’s head, interrupting the proceedings. Dean (what were you waiting for?!) shoves a knife into Randa’s chest, into her heart, which bursts into flames. Her eyes burn, too, as she catches fire from the inside out. Both Paul and the Oriental man fall down in puffs of smoke. Randa, the fire going out, falls down, dead. Dean clutches his chest, gasping, looking for Sam.
Dean assures Eleanor that it really is over now. “It had to be, one way or the other,” she agrees. “I had thought you might fail, and Randa would come after me,either way, I’d finally be at peace.” The brothers smile. “You take care of yourself,” Eleanor, Dean says. They leave.
In the car, Dean says, “Wow, back in business, got the wind,admit it, it feels good, huh?–I was thinking about what Randa said about what it feels like to be a warrior,I get it, man, I do.” “I know you do,” says Sam, “I don’t, not anymore, hell, maybe I never did.” “Come on, Sam, don’t ruin my buzz, huh?” Dean pleads. “Dean, when this is over,” says Sam, “when we close up shop on Kevin and the tablet, I’m done,I mean that.” “No you don’t,” says Dean. “The year I took off, I had something I’ve never had,” says Sam, “a normal life,I got to see what that felt like,I want that,I had that.” “I think that’s just how you feel right now,” says Dean, shaking his head.
Flashback – Sam, walking his dog across a bridge, is calling Amelia. “This isn’t funny,” he says, fearfully calling her. Riot goes chasing something, and Sam calls to him, too. He chases the dog into a clearing where Amelia has set up a picnic. “Happy birthday,” she cries, arms open wide, the dog lying at her feet. “What is this?” Sam asks. “You’ve never seen a birthday cake before?” She asks, smiling, “This is it,EAT!” He shakes his head, smiling, relieved. This is normal, wonderful, and he loves it. He walks to sit with her, his dog, and is happy.
Remembering, Sam grins. He looks at his brother. He knows what he really wants, and nothing Dean says can change that.
Wow, what an incredible episode! I loved the detective work, and the way the brothers worked to figure out this case. And what a great case, too! Body parts being ripped right out of chests, an athlete using a Mayan god to maintain his youth and vigor, but growing tired of it all eventually and killing himself,but not quite killing the curse that he brought on himself. This reminded me of season one, with the legwork, the computer work, and Sam and Dean bickering.
There was one big difference, though, this is a different Sam, a Sam determined to return to what must have been an idyllic life with Amelia. We saw, though, that when he thought he might have lost her, how scared Sam was, running along that bridge, calling to her, and, when he followed Riot, fearing he would come upon something horrible. Can Dean convince him to return to the hunting fold? Perhaps. Or will it take something supernatural killing Amelia to make that happen, just as it did with Jess? I guess that will depend on whether or not SUPERNATURAL sees a ninth season. All I know is, I had a blast watching this episode, and for so many reasons.
Questions –
1. Yay or nay? You know how much I loved it. I give it a 10. You?
2. What did you think of the plot in this episode? Was this original or did it seem a retread of another episode to you? What did you think of Brick Holmes’ deal with the Mayan god?
3. What did you think of the scene between Randa and Dean, with her sitting on top of him? Overtly sexual or what?
4. Sam and Dean almost got into a full-blown argument over Sam staying with hunting. Do you think Dean will finally let him go? After all, Dean got his year with Lisa and Ben but chose to return to hunting. Is Dean being fair to Sam? Is Sam being fair to Dean?
5. Amelia’s picnic for Sam reminded me of Lisa’s picnic with Dean. I WANT Sam to have his normal life, which is something he’s ALWAYS wanted, since season 1, episode 1. Do you think he should or shouldn’t have it?
6. What did you think of the gore factor in this episode? Pretty high with all those hearts being pulled from chests,and double ewww on the eating of the heart, too!
[b]1. Yay or nay? You know how much I loved it. I give it a 10. You?[/b]
I waffle. Great meta’s like this made me appreciate it more, but I wasn’t has happy while watching it. Partly because they had showed us that we would have Sam flashbacks and then that part was SO short. Partly because I personally didn’t see the parallels between the MOTW and Sam and Dean. Partly because Sam is being written and directed to act so disconnected with no explanation which loops me back to the lack of Sam flashbacks.
[b]2. What did you think of the plot in this episode? Was this original or did it seem a retread of another episode to you? What did you think of Brick Holmes’ deal with the Mayan god?[/b]
I thought the plot was reasonably original. I thought Brick’s deal was horrible and I think Betsy lived with and supported a serial killer for 40 years, so I did think she was a bit of a monster. 80 people died and she lived and slept with Brick like they didn’t count. I thought driving off the bridge was stupid when all Brick had to do was stop sacrificing people and the deal would be broken. Perhaps there was a scene that got cut that said there would be worse consequences if Brick welched, but it seemed like stop killing people, start to age and eventually die was a lot simpler than driving off a bridge. I also wondered when Brick got the god to make him look European instead of Mayan because although we know that people can have native American blood and still look like the don’t they can’t have it if they became immortal BEFORE the Europeans came to the Americas and once the did come to the Americas, the Mayan culture got pretty well buried. This long post basically says that in many ways these still are the writers of Route 666 and plotholes still abound.
[b]3. What did you think of the scene between Randa and Dean, with her sitting on top of him? Overtly sexual or what?[/b]
It was pretty overtly sexual. It also was interesting that Dean’s heart was being pulled out in little pieces by Sam not wanting to hunt and then being saved by Sam.
[b]4. Sam and Dean almost got into a full-blown argument over Sam staying with hunting. Do you think Dean will finally let him go? After all, Dean got his year with Lisa and Ben but chose to return to hunting. Is Dean being fair to Sam? Is Sam being fair to Dean?[/b]
I hope Dean will let Sam go, but he has resisted the idea that Sam can want different things from Dean and live a different life and still be Dean’s brother since season one. I hated Dean guilting Sam to get him to stay in the life. He was practically saying that Sam not hunting was the same as Sam shooting people in the head. People do die, but Sam has a right to opt out. I hated that Dean completely negated Sam’s feelings. Sam tells him he wants out and Dean tells him “no you don’t”. Sam’s detachment from Dean is hard to watch and painful, but I understand that Sam WANTS OUT. I really think he is trying to make certain that Dean knows this from the get go. Dean is telling Sam that the life Dean wants is driving down crazy street with Sam at his side. Sam doesn’t want that and I think he is trying to not give Dean false hope that it will happen. It may have been harsh that Sam stated he wanted his life to count for something, but the fact that Sam wants his life to count for something more than violence is what he feels. Sam and Dean have lied to each other so much that even if Sam is being harsh, he is being honest.
[b]5. Amelia’s picnic for Sam reminded me of Lisa’s picnic with Dean. I WANT Sam to have his normal life, which is something he’s ALWAYS wanted, since season 1, episode 1. Do you think he should or shouldn’t have it?[/b]
I absolutely think that if Sam wants a normal life he should have it. Dean can find other hunters to work with. Sam having a normal life DOESN’T mean that he and Dean will never see each other again. It could give Dean a home base, a place to come to after a hunt to decompress and rest and then find a new hunt. They can spend holidays and vacations together. If Sam wants they can go on occasional hunts together, or when Dean finds a case he can call Sam and Sam can do the research and get the results to Dean. Dean sees Sam hunting as being all or nothing, but it really isn’t that black and white.
[b]6. What did you think of the gore factor in this episode? Pretty high with all those hearts being pulled from chests—and double ewww on the eating of the heart, too!
[/b]
The gore factor was high, but I just closed my eyes during the heart eating moment. I’m getting good at knowing when gore that I can’t handle is coming and looking away.
[quote]I absolutely think that if Sam wants a normal life he should have it. Dean can find other hunters to work with. Sam having a normal life DOESN’T mean that he and Dean will never see each other again. It could give Dean a home base, a place to come to after a hunt to decompress and rest and then find a new hunt. They can spend holidays and vacations together. If Sam wants they can go on occasional hunts together, or when Dean finds a case he can call Sam and Sam can do the research and get the results to Dean. Dean sees Sam hunting as being all or nothing, but it really isn’t that black and white.[/quote]
whoa… i agree Sam has a right to want/have normal but just curious if what u said happened, is it a show u would watch? Dean hunting with someone else and Sam having picnics with Amelia or whoever. Man I for one wouldnt like it and this even though am a Dean girl 🙂
The brothers co-dependence and loyalty towards each other is what drives the show (for me atleast).
But I understand what u mean. It would be better if the writers somehow figured out a way to make Sam want (not forced) to hunt again.
For the purposes of the show, yes Sam has to hunt again, BUT Dean really needs to stop insisting that the only way he can be Sam’s brother is if Sam does it Dean’s way. Do I expect the show to have Sam drop out of hunting? Of course not. Do I want Dean to say to Sam what Lisa said to him, okay we’ll try to find a way for you to have some kind of normal and I know that you wanting normal doesn’t mean you don’t love me? Heck yeah!
Dean has been through a lot, but one of his less attractive traits, IMHO, is that he has totally dismissed Sam’s feelings about how Sam wants to live his life. He did it in season one where he refused to see that he and Sam could still be brothers if Sam went back to college after killing the thing that killed Jess and Mom. He couldn’t even comprehend that Sam was miserable changing schools in After School Special. It didn’t bother young Dean, so why should it bother Sammy? When Dean wants to quit then wanting to quit and stay with Lisa while Sam hunts is just fine. There is no “people die if we don’t hunt” from Dean when he chooses to let Sam hunt on his own or with the Campbells. Dean feels no guilt about Sam liking hunting while Dean has normal. Yeah, Sam was soulless at the time, but at that point in time Dean didn’t know that. All he knew was that Sam said that having Dean hunt with him would be better and Dean said he wanted to stay with Lisa. When Sam did get his soul back, he wanted to know why Dean left Lisa and it seemed he would have been fine if Dean had decided to go back.
Now Dean wants to hunt and he is dismissing any feelings Sam has otherwise as being “bad” and making Sam unworthy. If Sam doesn’t hunt, people will die and IT WILL BE ALL SAM’S FAULT. Dean will be hurt if Sam goes back to college. Dean even tell Sam that Sam doesn’t know what he wants because it isn’t what Dean wants. If the relationship between Sam and Dean is to be healthy then Dean needs to accept that Sam DOES want some normal in his life. That maybe he needs more than their “annual trip to Vegas” that only happened once. Dean needs to stop mocking Sam for liking fresh produce and give Sam a few crumbs to help Sam get his needs met. We have a summer hiatus and a winter hiatus, can’t we have an agreement between the boys that they will take a couple of months off that don’t get shown? Can’t we have Sam earn a degree online, so that he can feel he has accomplished something he wants to accomplish? Or even have the training to get a job is there comes a time that they both want to settle down?
I suggested in another post that giving Sam a dog to be a companion would help give Sam some part of normal to hold onto. I got jumped on because Dean is afraid of dogs after being dragged to Hell by Hell Hounds. Well Sam doesn’t want to hunt. He wants to feel safe and if he comes back into the life then maybe Dean needs to make some concessions to help Sam be happy.
wow… i stirred a hornets nest there i think. sorry percyowner i think u are very upset. actually am very easy to please. even when dean didnt have much of a storyline for a few seasons i still enjoyed the show. cos i’m crazy like that. maybe becos u are way more invested in the characters or should i say character than me. i really like how u feel for Sam. its great. but stepping back just a little bit made me enjoy the episodes more. anyway i sincerely hope u get a resolution to all the angst this season.
as for me i just enjoy e’thing they throw at me. i realised early on, that the show is way more enjoyable and has a great effect on me when I dont get too personally involved. btw i have nothing against people who do. SPN has the most involved and passionate fans ever. and its a good thing too. here’s hoping u enjoy season 8 and feel better abt Sam’s arc soon 🙂
Hi, I realize that you are a passionate defender of Sam, I respect that truly. But I was involved in the “dog” discussion and I just agreed with Sweetondean that Dean might have some issues with a dog in the back seat. I didn’t think you were jumped on. I actually thought it was sort of a lighthearted back and forth. Sam’s clown phobia vs Dean’s issues with dogs. I was enjoying the short discussion. I’m sorry you felt jumped on.
[quote]Dean’s issues with dogs.[/quote]I am sorry i really am confused.what issues?
anonymousN, Sorry we had a small discussion on sweetondean’s review thread. It started with a mention of the hellhound ripping Dean apart and various other dog related encounters Dean has had with dogs, including getting killed in Mytery Spot by one.
oh ok
I’m not trying to start an argument here but just wanted to point out a few things. Last season when Dean wanted to give up hunting Sam was the one who urged him on (i was happy abt that btw). He was one who said what they did mattered. In fact he was the one who wanted to save Krissy’s dad and hunt the vetala. He didnt want Dean to hang up the hunting boots. So it may be difficult for Dean to understand how suddenly Sam has had a change of heart. Maybe he thinks Sam is depressed & detached and that its his job now to pep Sam up and get him back into the groove (the way Sam did for Dean). Pls note that Sam tells Dean that there was a girl and now there isn’t. So Dean doesnt think he’s pulling Sam away from a loved one. So I dont see it as Dean berating Sam or Sam insulting Dean as some fans are suggesting. Just my opinion. I may be wrong.
Dean wasn’t proposing to retire from hunting and do something else at any point in s7. In the Krissy episode, he wanted to pursue the Leviathans and revenge, and went off to do so while Sam pursued the Krissy thing. The argument was the equivalent and reverse of Wendigo or Scarecrow in s1, not an equivalent to Sam and Dean now.
There have been several occasions when Dean has been down about hunting and Sam has given him pep talks (What Is and What Never Should Be, Mannequin). But there’s a huge difference between someone saying “Why are we doing this when it hurts so much and never goes right?” and someone else saying “Because it has meaning,” and the situation we have now. Now Sam is saying “I don’t want to be doing this, I want (eventually) to be doing something else that has more meaning to me.” Dean isn’t pepping Sam up when he expresses doubts, he’s contradicting him when he says what he wants, and accusing him of letting people die if he lives his own life.
By the way, I wonder how Dean feels now about persuading Krissy and her father to leave hunting. Doesn’t that make Dean, and them, responsible for the deaths of everyone they might have saved if they were still hunting?
[quote]
By the way, I wonder how Dean feels now about persuading Krissy and her father to leave hunting. Doesn’t that make Dean, and them, responsible for the deaths of everyone they might have saved if they were still hunting?[/quote]
I know we can’t expect J2 to have answers for questions like these, necessarily, but it would be nice to have some of these more probing questions asked at cons, etc. At least let the writers/showrunners know the types of things the fans are wondering about.
Is that naive of me?
[quote]By the way, I wonder how Dean feels now about persuading Krissy and her father to leave hunting. Doesn’t that make Dean, and them, responsible for the deaths of everyone they might have saved if they were still hunting?[/quote]
Pretty much the way Sam should feel now after spending whole of last season convincing Dean and the audience that saving lives and hunting mattered. That it was something that counts.
But Dean and Sam, at the time, thought of it as saving Krissy (and maybe somewhat her father, but mostly Krissy). Dean thought that other things Krissy might do could have value, that she could go to college, become a pediatrician. Do you really think that Dean should go to Krissy and her dad now and urge them to get back in? Tell them that people are dying because they left?
I honestly think that if, in the second half of season 6 or season 7, Dean had told Sam that he wanted a different life, that he was going back to try again with Lisa (before the mind wipe made that problematic) or that he wanted to go to school, Sam wouldn’t have objected or told him that he had to hunt. Sam thought hunting had meaning (though he also felt a lack of choice in the last couple of seasons — his answer to Colt in 6.18, his weary I guess when Dean asked him if he wanted to go on working in s7), but that doesn’t mean he thought hunting was the only thing that had meaning or counted.
perfectly said percysowner
When Dean wants to quit then wanting to quit and stay with Lisa while Sam hunts is just fine. There is no “people die if we don’t hunt” from Dean when he chooses to let Sam hunt on his own or with the Campbells. Dean feels no guilt about Sam liking hunting while Dean has normal. Yeah, Sam was soulless at the time, but at that point in time Dean didn’t know that. All he knew was that Sam said that having Dean hunt with him would be better and Dean said he wanted to stay with Lisa. When Sam did get his soul back, he wanted to know why Dean left Lisa and it seemed he would have been fine if Dean had decided to go back.
that’s exactly what i want to say so thank you 🙂
I think the best thing the show could do, now that they have set up this particular conflict, is modify the format of the show. Let Sam and Dean become something more like Bobby at Singer Salvage, or Ellen at the Roadhouse. Make the outcome of the conflict a genuine compromise, not a concession or even a conversion of one to the other’s POV (and, let’s face it, that would mean Sam being the one conceding or being converted, simply because of the nature of the show). Sam could have stability, a home base, a chance to pursue other activities as well as hunting, a relationship, if Amelia was still around. Dean could have being actively involved in saving people, working with his brother at his side, using his skills and knowledge, spending some of his time on the road, as Bobby and Rufus both did. And the show could have something to keep it from falling into a repetitious procedural by holding on too hard to its formula. It might be a somewhat different kind of show, but it wouldn’t leap out of genre, just become more DS9, less STTNG.
[quote]I think the best thing the show could do, now that they have set up this particular conflict, is modify the format of the show. Let Sam and Dean become something more like Bobby at Singer Salvage, or Ellen at the Roadhouse. Make the outcome of the conflict a genuine compromise, not a concession or even a conversion of one to the other’s POV (and, let’s face it, that would mean Sam being the one conceding or being converted, simply because of the nature of the show). Sam could have stability, a home base, a chance to pursue other activities as well as hunting, a relationship, if Amelia was still around. Dean could have being actively involved in saving people, working with his brother at his side, using his skills and knowledge, spending some of his time on the road, as Bobby and Rufus both did. And the show could have something to keep it from falling into a repetitious procedural by holding on too hard to its formula. It might be a somewhat different kind of show, but it wouldn’t leap out of genre, just become more DS9, less STTNG.[/quote]
Gosh I hope they don’t go that far. Nope. To continue this job, it means constant travelling, and therefore constant separation in this scenario. If Sam were to take on the Bobby role, manning the phones and living with his gf, while Dean travelled cross country, I probably wouldn’t watch. Sorry. No.
It wouldn’t have to. On the Deep Space Nine vs STTNG model, you can have just as interesting stories with a stable base as always on the move. I wasn’t suggesting that Sam become Bobby or Ellen, and Dean continue his current lifestyle, I was suggesting they BOTH become Bobby or Ellen, have a life that’s neither pure on the road hunting nor pure domesticity. I imagine that Sam would also spend some time on the road. The whole point is for Sam and Dean to be doing something together that was neither Sam’s life nor Dean’s life, but a genuine compromise that incorporated elements of both of their wants and needs and was what they were both doing, together.
I loved DS9, but that concept doesn’t work for this show. For this show to work, both boys have to be on the road, hunting. Once they settle down, the show is over, IMO.
Oh I see. Sorry I misinterpreted what you were saying.
Still don’t think I’d like it, tho. I’d give it a chance, but it doesn’t sound as intriguing to me…..
I don’t see this as an option at anytime. We have to remember what happened several times once Dean had allowed himself to try and have a “Normal” life. First the djinn found him after they found Sam and then after Dean leaves Lisa and Ben, Crowley has them kidnapped. It is too dangerous for them to bring innocent people into the mix. Maybe if they hooked up with other female hunters the relationships could stand half a chance but then it didn’t work too well for Tamara and her husband in Season 3, Magnificent Seven. Personally, I wouldn’t like that direction. We don’t want our boys hooking up with another female now do we? I’d say if this were the last season, ok then maybe that would be a nice way to end it instead of the way Jensen and Jared say they should go out in a blaze of glory. Since there are hopefully at least 2 more seasons to write, they cannot have them settle down to a normal life. JMO.
I don’t know how to replay with quote, so…. I agree with you Sammy for this.
quote:
The brothers co-dependence and loyalty towards each other is what drives the show (for me atleast).
But I understand what u mean. It would be better if the writers somehow figured out a way to make Sam want (not forced) to hunt again.unquote.
I know I wouldn’t enjoy watching Sam living a normal life. That would make a lousy show for me who loves the brothers together. And it would never be written that way until perhaps the final few episodes of the series. Then, I would appreciate them both having lives with their own families.l (Hehee! Lisa for Dean, Sarah and Sam. Have future flashes with them as the boys start off in Baby to another hunt. Letting us know they will eventually receive the reward they so deserve. Just my wishes for the end of the series. No going out in any blaze of so-called glory!)
[quote]No going out in any blaze of so-called glory![/quote]agree
[b]1. Yay or nay? You know how much I loved it. I give it a 10. You?[/b]
Sorry to be a downer, but I was really bored through the episode. Had I not been curious what they were going to do with Sam’s flashback, I would have changed the channel about 35 minutes into it. So I’d give it about a 3.
[b]2. What did you think of the plot in this episode? Was this original or did it seem a retread of another episode to you? What did you think of Brick Holmes’ deal with the Mayan god?[/b]
The Mayan god storyline didn’t feel rehashed, or at least I don’t remember anything similar. The “you need to let me go” part was most definitely a retread of seasons 1-5.
[b]3. What did you think of the scene between Randa and Dean, with her sitting on top of him? Overtly sexual or what?[/b]
Overtly sexual, but I was expecting that from these writers. Their trademark seems to be putting Dean in sexual situations.
[b]4. Sam and Dean almost got into a full-blown argument over Sam staying with hunting. Do you think Dean will finally let him go? After all, Dean got his year with Lisa and Ben but chose to return to hunting. Is Dean being fair to Sam? Is Sam being fair to Dean?[/b]
I don’t think the question is whether Dean will let Sam go (we already got this in season 5 when Dean let Sam jump into the pit), but whether Sam is ready to start forcing his own will in this relationship. Sam is a grown up, and when he makes a decision he needs to stick to his guns. He needs to go and pick up his dog and plop him in the back seat, and he needs to take time out when he feels he needs time out. Of course Sam won’t really end up leaving hunting because that would be bad for the show, so something will motivate him to stay.
[b]5. Amelia’s picnic for Sam reminded me of Lisa’s picnic with Dean. I WANT Sam to have his normal life, which is something he’s ALWAYS wanted, since season 1, episode 1. Do you think he should or shouldn’t have it?[/b]
Again, I think Sam should have whatever life he wants to make for himself. He doesn’t have to stop taking care of himself in order to be there for Dean.
[b]6. What did you think of the gore factor in this episode? Pretty high with all those hearts being pulled from chests—and double ewww on the eating of the heart, too![/b]
I don’t care for gore, but I usually just look away and soon forget about it. It was high in this episode.
1. [i] Yay or nay? You know how much I loved it. I give it a 10. You?[/i]
I’d give it an 7.5 probably, because of the jarring difference between this and the first two episodes is the reason. I want the Purgatory story — that’s what is interesting so far this season. And, I do like conflict between the brothers, but so far we haven’t got to the meat of that conflict, because we don’t know what went on with Sam during the lost year.
2. [i] What did you think of the plot in this episode? Was this original or did it seem a retread of another episode to you? What did you think of Brick Holmes’ deal with the Mayan god?[/i]
I liked the plot, but I’m in the camp that Betsy was a co-conspirator in all the murders and Sam and Dean being so sweet to her didn’t feel right. Dean, at least, should have had some harsh words for her to let her and the audience know that this fact wasn’t overlooked.
3. [i] What did you think of the scene between Randa and Dean, with her sitting on top of him? Overtly sexual or what?[/i]
Hot. I may be jealous of that actress.
4.[i] Sam and Dean almost got into a full-blown argument over Sam staying with hunting. Do you think Dean will finally let him go? After all, Dean got his year with Lisa and Ben but chose to return to hunting. Is Dean being fair to Sam? Is Sam being fair to Dean?[/i]
It’s not a matter of Dean ‘letting’ Sam do anything. I don’t even think this is a serious discussion, because it isn’t going to happen in the Show.
5. [i]Amelia’s picnic for Sam reminded me of Lisa’s picnic with Dean. I WANT Sam to have his normal life, which is something he’s ALWAYS wanted, since season 1, episode 1. Do you think he should or shouldn’t have it?[/i]
Again, not something I even think about given the context of the show. If, at the end of the run when SPN is cancelled, let Sam go off and live with his girlfriend. Until then, it just isn’t a realistic option.
6. [i] What did you think of the gore factor in this episode? Pretty high with all those hearts being pulled from chests—and double ewww on the eating of the heart, too![/i]
Lots of gore and even some realistic tough guy language. I liked that.
Ginger, you have said my thoughts (again). Ditto.
1: I give it a big 10! (Especially the directing)
2: I liked the plot. It was different in the fact that the “god” never showed up. They were just dealing with the “deal”
3: Overly sexual? No way!She was trying to rip out his heart. Personally I don’t find that sexual. If she would have done some “other things” with her hands while he was held down, it could have been, but no-not the way it was shot . (It just put her in a power position)
4: Sam & Dean being fair to one another? They are both being true to their heart,s and natures at this point. Sam isn’t being realistic. I think he will figure that out. Everyone wishes for a better life. No matter what you have, it is human nature to dream of what you don’t. That doesn’t mean you walk away from your life. Dean knows there are only a handful of people that can do what they do-and no one does it better than them.PERIOD.
5: Normal life for Sam? NO-Not now. He HAD that for the last year. And from the story line, HE walked away. He has always had a passion for saving people. He lost that when he lost everyone he loved. I get it, who wouldn’t??
6: Gore factor? Didn’t really think it was that bad. They have had MUCH worse. Arms in garbage disposals; heads splattered on walls; exploding feet on doors; woman engulfed in flames. The worse thing this week was the chick taking a bite out of the heart; but knowing it’s fake, who cares??
Every week seems to be a new gem for us to enjoy.
1. Yay or nay? You know how much I loved it. I give it a 10. You?
Its a yay for me. I’ll give it a 10 cos I can’t think of anything I didnt like in this episode. It could have had a bit more Sam flashbacks but am ok with the slow reveal. Its interesting. Missed the purgatory scenes though. Ackles Sr & Jr on screen was a big plus for me.
2. What did you think of the plot in this episode? Was this original or did it seem a retread of another episode to you? What did you think of Brick Holmes’ deal with the Mayan god?
I liked the plot & thought it was quite original. But it didnt seem scary. It had more gore than pure horror. I hadn’t watched the promos or read any spoilers so the deal with the Mayan god was a nice plot point for me.
3. What did you think of the scene between Randa and Dean, with her sitting on top of him? Overtly sexual or what?
Boy it was hot, hot, hot. Dean on the floor yumm… now am a drooling mess on the floor 😳
4. Sam and Dean almost got into a full-blown argument over Sam staying with hunting. Do you think Dean will finally let him go? After all, Dean got his year with Lisa and Ben but chose to return to hunting. Is Dean being fair to Sam? Is Sam being fair to Dean?
Sam mostly has his way. Even in season 1 when Dean asks him to hunt he says no. Dean drops him at college but Sam rejoins only after Jess’ death. I’ve never seem Sam do something purely becos Dean wants him to. He’s quite capabale of making decisions and sticking to them. Its only in moments when he is undecided that he goes along with Dean’s plan till he gets his mind cleared. So Dean does not have to let him go, he’ll go if he wants to.
I also dont think they are being unfair. After all we take liberty with the ones closest to us. Asking for things from loved ones & family is not unnatural or unfair. But one must be able to accept it if they dont get it.
5. Amelia’s picnic for Sam reminded me of Lisa’s picnic with Dean. I WANT Sam to have his normal life, which is something he’s ALWAYS wanted, since season 1, episode 1. Do you think he should or shouldn’t have it?
As Ginger said it is not something I think about given the context/premise of the show. Maybe when the show ends.
6. What did you think of the gore factor in this episode? Pretty high with all those hearts being pulled from chests—and double ewww on the eating of the heart, too!
As I said earlier there was more gore than horror. But I dont mind it. Used to it now after 8 seasons.
1. I give it a 10. You?
[i] I give it a 3.[/i]
2. What did you think of the plot in this episode? Was this original or did it seem a retread of another episode to you? What did you think of Brick Holmes’ deal with the Mayan god?
[i]The plot felt like a retreat and all the gore/violence pushed me away. The Mayan god was treated the same (BADLY) as every other non-Judeo-Christian diety.[/i]
3. What did you think of the scene between Randa and Dean, with her sitting on top of him? Overtly sexual or what?
[i]By that far into the episode, I didn’t even care. I was forcing myself to see when the “Sam centered flashback episode” was going to start.[/i]
4. Is Dean being fair to Sam? Is Sam being fair to Dean?
[i]Both are being self-centered dicks to their brother. The lack of information on Sam is getting to me . I had hoped that they wouldn’t do another tired retreat of “what’s wrong with Sammy” that they have been doing for the majority of the time SPN has been on the air. BUT I was wrong. Makes me sad to see the lack of imagination towards Sam. NO, I’m not a Sam girl. I just love the SPN verse.[/i]
5. [i]Re: Sam and the normal life. He’s spending alot of time trying to convince Dean, but I think he’s trying to convince himself of something. There is a big WHY that’s not explained. Are they going to wait until the last handful of episode of explain things (like they have for the last several years). The last several years started strong and had mostly filler episodes until the last month of the season and rushed to explain things that they should have all along slowly. I feel very burned as a fan because of the last two years and what Carver has done so far in regards to Sam has me wondering (and NOT in a good way).[/i]
6. What did you think of the gore factor in this episode?[i] If it had been a part of a cohesive episode it wouldn’t have bothered me. Like a said above, overall I give this episode a 3. [/i]
Sorry–for so reason I kept writing retreat instead of RETREAD.
1. Yay or nay? You know how much I loved it. I give it a 10. You?
Big yay!
2. What did you think of the plot in this episode? Was this original or did it seem a retread of another episode to you? What did you think of Brick Holmes’ deal with the Mayan god?
The plot was good, but I’m more into the relationship with the boys. That was great! Sammy scares me about him leaving Dean. Something must happen to make him realize he really wants to stay with him. Or this show will be about one hunter with a short life expectancy. Fascinated to see this pan out in future episodes. How they get back on the same page.
3. What did you think of the scene between Randa and Dean, with her sitting on top of him? Overtly sexual or what?
Don’t think Randa appreciated it as much as I would have! Rrowf! 😛
4. Sam and Dean almost got into a full-blown argument over Sam staying with hunting. Do you think Dean will finally let him go? After all, Dean got his year with Lisa and Ben but chose to return to hunting. Is Dean being fair to Sam? Is Sam being fair to Dean?
It’s OK for Sam to want normal. He always has. I just wish he could voice it differently so Dean doesn’t feel he will again be abandoned. And really, that won’t happen anyway on this show. Sammy loves his Dean. Why can’t he let Dean know that? Dean is terrified to be abandoned by his only remaining family. 🙁
5. Amelia’s picnic for Sam reminded me of Lisa’s picnic with Dean. I WANT Sam to have his normal life, which is something he’s ALWAYS wanted, since season 1, episode 1. Do you think he should or shouldn’t have it?
The show would have to end for him to have it. That scene was idealized in his memory. If it was so ideal, why haven’t they kept in touch? Why did she watch him leave without a word? Something weird about that. And Sammy had about 4 years of normal. Look how that turned out! And he didn’t know the demons were manipulating him. Does he think they and other hunters would just forget about him and let him be? He would still be hostage for any enemies of his brother unless Dean were really dead.
Let Sam get his normal life in the very last episode. (Hopefully with Sarah Blake)
6. What did you think of the gore factor in this episode? Pretty high with all those hearts being pulled from chests—and double ewww on the eating of the heart, too!
Triple ewwww and yuck yuck as well! 😀
Thanks Robin for the all the dialogue I missed the first time. 🙂
1. Yay or nay? You know how much I loved it. I give it a 10. You?
I also give it a 10 – great storytelling, script, directing, and acting all around.
2. What did you think of the plot in this episode? Was this original or did it seem a retread of another episode to you? What did you think of Brick Holmes’ deal with the Mayan god?
It seemed quite original, which is what kept me interested.
3. What did you think of the scene between Randa and Dean, with her sitting on top of him? Overtly sexual or what?
There was certainly some twisted sexual tension there, but I attribute that to her being evil. It was not unexpected. It actually kind of reminded me of the cat-lady demi-god in S6’s “You Can’t Handle the Truth.”
4. Sam and Dean almost got into a full-blown argument over Sam staying with hunting. Do you think Dean will finally let him go? After all, Dean got his year with Lisa and Ben but chose to return to hunting. Is Dean being fair to Sam? Is Sam being fair to Dean?
I didn’t consider it anywhere close to a “full blown argument.” I also don’t think this tension is or should be about fairness. Sam and Dean for the first time in a long time are being very open and emotionally honest with one another. They each know what they want at this time, though it may be different than what they each wanted before, and it may change as the season progresses. What matters is – they aren’t afraid to express their desires to each other. This is a good thing, IMO. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with what either brother wants – but Dean seems to be the one who needs to be more gracious in this instance. And Sam opening up more, sharing more of his year, is the best thing for that. I can’t wait to see how it pans out!
5. Amelia’s picnic for Sam reminded me of Lisa’s picnic with Dean. I WANT Sam to have his normal life, which is something he’s ALWAYS wanted, since season 1, episode 1. Do you think he should or shouldn’t have it?
Yes, of course Sam and Dean both deserve peaceful, happy lives. It’s not a possibility so long as SPN is on air, however – JC may be setting this up for the how the series ends in S10 – who knows?
6. What did you think of the gore factor in this episode? Pretty high with all those hearts being pulled from chests—and double ewww on the eating of the heart, too!
It was kind of nasty – especially the heart-eating scene. I think the show – like many horror movies – has often equated gore with scariness, which at least for me, is not the case.