Let’s Speculate: Supernatural 9×04 “Slumber Party”
Brief recap:
First, I love Robbie Thompson. I love his scripts. I love his reading of the Winchesters. I just love him. This episode was strong in many ways but it also fell short in some, at least for me. The episode begins with a flashback sequence to 1935 and two what seem like agents coming into the bunker. We skip ahead six months and the bunker is where Dorothy ends up – she’s a hunter and apparently has father issues. #ahunterwhohatesdaddy #whoknew
She’s trying to find a way to kill the wicked witch, as all her hunter ways have not been able to do that – although she did take out the witch’s tongue. The flashback sequence extends into the first half hour and we see that the witch occupies one of the agents and a series of events lead to a kind of suspended animation for Dorothy and the witch – when one wakes up later, the other does because they are soul bonded, it seems. #imprintingparallel #zekeandsamaresoulbuddies
While we get the backstory on Dorothy, we learn that Dean has taken Kevin to Branson, Missouri for a Kenny Rogers and porn weekend as a respite from angel tablet translation. Sam is trying to figure out a way to help Castiel while Dean shows up with “Game of Thrones” season one, which has an interesting sibling relationship in it (that’s all I’m gonna say). Charlie shows up and she’s had a difficult time since we last saw her, but she’s also been hunting, which enrages big brother/macho Dean. Luckily the boys were trying to figure out a way to hack the computer that tracks angels and lo and behold, Charlie the hacker can help. She sets up the files on her gaming laptop and then snuggles in with the boys in Sam’s room, and yeah, only lesbians get to spend the night and survive. #houserules
Hacking leads to cocoons in your bunker. #publicserviceannouncement #itsprobablyametaphor
Dean cuts into the moth-like cocoon and out falls Dorothy, or as I’d like to think of her, GirlDean. Charlie, who was looking for adventure, now has it. It seems the wicked witch is trying to find a way back to Oz and Dorothy needs to stop her. The quartet try to figure out how to track down the witch, who has found Crowley (and let me say, any episode with Mark Shepard is in a win column for me). She writes him a love note and scurries off to find the key and we know what that means! There also has to be a lock! #iftheresakeythentheremustalsobealock #samwinchesterwordsofwisdom
After Sam and Dean mini-torture Crowley again, they chase after the wicked witch while Dorothy and Charlie squabble in that totally ‘hate to love’ romcom formula that will do them well when they get to Oz. In the other romcom relationship we learn that Sam still is clinging to his ‘I got nobody’ schtick about the bunker while Dean worries over cleaning up the mess left by the wicked witch, in his kitchen. #goshdarnitbeav #donnareidftw
The climax of the episode starts with the scene that makes my blood boil – Charlie’s “death” and Dean calling out Zeke to resurrect her. I cannot describe the fury I have for this storyline. I mean, there are no words for my rage. I don’t criticize Thompson here but the whole arc. Ezekiel and his the more I do the longer I stay line made me go, “Yeah, right.” In this episode, Sam has so many people in him that he’s hosting the cast of an early 1990s house party film. And then Dean lies so smoothly that I’m starting to think that he’s definitely not my point of view character anymore. AND what’s even worse is that this consensual abomination is happening in an episode written with a great love for the female character. Okay, I’ll stop my rant, but know I am not happy. #deepbreathslinda #yourzenplaceisacklesface
So anyway, after the deux ex “we don’t know what the hell to do with Sam so we soul violate him” healing happens, the quartet split off into their romcom pairs again. Dorothy and Charlie finally realize the ruby slippers are magical and can kill the witch! Meanwhile the witch turns Sam and Dean into her minions (and I’m betting Misha is pissed that all it took was a touch to do this). Thompson writes awesome non-Sam and non-Dean. I was reminded of the Leviachesters here and I missed them for a moment. #sohottheyreburning #ilovemeevilsamanddean
As Flying Monkey Dean and Sam stalk the girls, Charlie kicks FMDean in the nuts and runs off to save the day, with the brand new ruby red slipper that Dorothy throws to her. As the witch opens the portal and we get the most beautiful special effects this show has ever done, Charlie comes up behind her and goes sixth grade slumber party rage girl and stabs the crone in the head with the shoe. Sam and Dean are disembarked but Sam still has passengers. The episode ends with a porn shot of Baby in the garage, Sam giving his fellow father hater, Dorothy, her father’s book, and Charlie agreeing to go on an adventure with Dorothy back to save Oz from the near-racist metaphors of flying monkeys (I see you, Baum). The door opens and shows an idyllic Oz. Charlie and Dorothy walk the yellow brick road toward the Emerald City as Sam and Dean look on in envy and amazement at the special effects that will surely bust the first half season’s budget. And the lesson I learned? Thompson knows how to play the irony here in an episode that has a title card dedicated to the fans he ends the episode by subtly reminding us that “It’s their story to write”. And I also learned that Sam and Dean are friends of Dorothy. #isoknewit #calleditfirstseason
What I Liked:
1. Thompson’s script and humor. I love him.
2. Dorothy and Charlie need to be the spin-off. #needmorevaginas
3. Crowley and his magnificent airing out.
4. Special effects for the mo-fo-win.
5. Charlie Bradbury makes me happy.
6. Dean’s house husband ways.
7. “Game of Thrones” reference for all of the snarky things I can say about sibling relationships on television.
8. Did I mention Thompson’s dialogue? Because I love it and him. Did I mention that?
9. Parallel of Dorothy and Sam – I’m going to read Bobby as Scarecrow, Dean as the Lion, and Death as Tinman in the premiere now. Because I can.
10. Kevin in a down-home, country porn weekend.
What I didn’t like:
1. Pacing was a little off and flashbacks were kind of a dead end.
2. That Abomination of a soul storyline, forever. #feministrage
3. Castiel somewhere being homeless. No good, show. No good.
4. Did I mention that Abomination of a soul storyline?!
Theories of the Week:
Theory, the first: Everyone is Dorothy. Cas is trying to get home. The angels are trying to get home. Abaddon is trying to get home. Crowley is trying to get home. Kevin is trying to get home. Sam is somewhere inside his own mind trying to get home. The only one that is home is Dean and that’s about to shatter into a million pieces once his brother finds out what he allowed to have done to him.
Theory, the second: Ezekiel is a lying liar who lies and we should all beware of the man hiding behind that curtain. Oh and by the way, this episode is so curtainfic. Look that up on fanlore if you don’t know the term.
Theory, the third: Thompson will say yes to my marriage proposal.
For me, the most significant event was seeing Sam’s room! After all the countless fan complaints I’ve read about not seeing his room? His bed is hard as bricks! Typical Sam. I’m shocked he had a flat screen though. Is that where he watches his porn?
Plus the kitchen, and Baby’s got a garage now? She looked so marvelous in there I cried. Literally. Plus, I also loved Sam’s final line. “There’s no place like home.” HA! So perfect.
Plus Crowley was great too. I hope he gets out soon though. Sorry, I was too giddy over the little nuggets like that to really try and get into the mythology. Maybe I’m too exhausted from all the crap last week.
Yeah and I forgot to mention that I loved the fanfic line as well as BeckyWinchester176 scene. I’m glad they went back and explained that the post season 3 books were released.
Overall I liked the episode. I enjoyed it for being the fun thing it was supposed to be.
I thought it was great! I love Charlie! I loved that he filled in a lot of gaps (instead of adding to them -what a novelty). Fantastic dialogue! We saw Sam’s room and they gave me a explanation that made sense as to why he was resistant to calling it home. I thought of the GoT siblings too. I wondered if that was deliberate. I love hope they took a night of downtime. How Sam questioned Cas’ leaving. And a bunch of other stuff.
And I’ll admit I love all the squicky consent issues that go along with Dean’s decisions this year. I like that he knows he isn’t necessarily doing the “right” thing but can’t seem to figure a way out and is floundering because of it. That’s some good Winchester angst.
I got all misty eyed when Sam said the no place like home line. I can’t lie. Misty eyed and lumpy throated….
🙄
I was fairly disappointed in this episode. I’m with you on the big thing of Dean repeatedly calling Zeke forth and ignoring the ways this violates Sam. But some little things got me as well. I was unhappy when, after Dean and Sam were possessed, Charlie called on DEAN to fight it. She has read the books. She knows that SAM is the one who had the ability to fight possession, not Dean. In fact, this may be the first time Dean has ever been possessed, IIR. I was really bothered by the multiple possession of Sam. If Sam had lost consciousness again due to having 3 people in his head, I would have bought it. I mean I know they “killed” Charlie so they could say Zeke was too weak to fight the Wicked Witch, even when they were sharing a body, but really, come on!
I also admit to feeling let down due to wrong expectations. Jared said that he would bond with Dorothy and tell her things he couldn’t tell Dean and then he tells her the exact same thing he later tells Dean, that he doesn’t feel like he has ever had a home. We learned more about Charlie and her do godding herself out of her job and her dreams of what hunting should be like than we did about Sam. Heck we learned more about Zeke, that he is only at half power, that he claims to want out of Sam’s body then we learned about Sam. And this was a perfect opportunity for us to hear about Sam. When Dorothy tied herself to the witch and took them both out of both worlds, it was a direct parallel with Sam tying himself to Lucifer and going into the Cage. But no, we can’t possibly hear anything about that.
Now, I”m going to say something a bit controversial. I love Robbie Thompson’s dialog, storylines, and characters other than Sam and Dean. I’m not sure he enjoys writing Sam and Dean and I don’t think he does a great job writing real Sam and Dean or maybe just Sam. This is his list of episodes
7.06 Slash Fiction which had more LeviSam and Dean than real S&D
7.12 Time After Time a lot of focus on Chronos and Dean got nice representation with Elliot Ness Sam did get a nice scene with Jodie,
7.20 The Girl with the Dungeons and Dragons Tattoo With a huge focus on Charlie and not much Sam and Dean although Charlie did start bonding with Dean,
8.04 Bitten The episode with the least Sam and Dean of the series
8.11 LARP and the Real Girl Charlie Heavy lots of interacting with Dean, Sam not there that much
8.17 Goodbye Strange good look at Meg, Cas’s struggle with Naomi and Dean overcoming Naomi’s influence of Cas. Sam, well we got some insight on Sam but we heard it from MEG, not Sam. Meg tells us what Sam is thinking, Sam not so much.
8.20 Pac-Man Fever very Charlie and Dean heavy, Sam not so much
So I’m torn. I like Robby Thompson as a writer for many reasons, but I end up feeling something is lacking in his episodes.
Did I mention how happy I was to add “For Those About To Rock We Salute You” to the SPN song catalog? Another AC/DC classic! Haven’t had one of those in a while.
I did the rewatch. Still happy!
I LOVE this episode. Right now it’s one of my all time favourites and I’ve only watched it once.
But I had a bit of a light bulb moment reading the comments here. I think it might be safe to say that Dean has become a bit of an addict when it comes to bring people he cares about back from the dead.
He knows it’s not right but, despite his humming and hawing over whether or not he should, he always gives in in the end, like he can’t actually help himself.
Sam’s “There’s no place like home” made me all warm and fuzzy.
Baby in the garage with all those classic motor vehicles made me swoon.
I know Felicia Day is a busy woman but, we need to see more Charlie. (and I was extra excited because she had just finished filming that episode and then she came to VanCon! which was AWESOME).
AMAZING special effects. The VFX team totally outdid themselves.
Dean and the “I just cleaned this place” made me laugh so much.
Sigh….now I need to see if I can fall asleep. Yea…right. 😀
[quote]Did I mention how happy I was to add “For Those About To Rock We Salute You” to the SPN song catalog? Another AC/DC classic! Haven’t had one of those in a while.
I did the rewatch. Still happy![/quote]
Alice! AC/DC! Nothing like a bit of ACaDaCa! WOOO! *fist pumps air*
I enjoyed it. It was fun. I love Charlie and her relationship with both Sam and Dean. The effects were great. That is my fist impression and that’s what I am sticking with. 🙂
Good ep by Mr. Robbie Thompson! So nice to have Charlie back … hoping she comes back from Oz at some point though! But again, Dean is lying! He lied to Sam about why he sent Cas away and almost sounded panicked when he thought Sam might have talked to him. I love Dean but he is sliding down the slope and I just hope he can stop it before it gets really ugly and Sam is smart enough that he’s going to figure it out sooner or later. But it’s all part of the angst and although it bothers me sometimes watching Sam, Dean and Cas sitting around the bunker watching movies or whatever without a care in the world would be super boring so there’s that.
I hadn’t really thought of comparing Sam, Dean and Cas to characters to characters from the Wizard of Oz but that’s interesting … might have to simmer on that for a while.
Overall, loved it and as much as I did love last weeks ep (leaving out the weird reaper issue) it was nice to see something a bit lighter. Baby looking great and safe in the garage and AC/DC pumping … nice!
Nice episode, it is interesting to see too how the writers manage to introduce stories without the J’s in every frame. I know they had to cut down filming times for these actors, I was afraid it will somehow ruin the rhythm of the show, I have seen this so many times in other shows, but so far, it is working with SPN.
I have a question about Crowley. He is powerless because of the sigils and binding stuff, but all of these prevents him from sense the Angel in Sam too? I know they can smell Angels or recognize them like he did with the wiener Angel…can’t remember his name.
I’m not a big nit picker about Supernatural but in the book the slippers were silver not ruby red. BIG deal in the book-whether to base the US monetary system on silver or gold. I’m just surprised that one flew right by.
I still loved the episode.
@ #9 racestaffer, wouldn’t Charlie be the Cowardly Lion?
Dude, I haaaaaated this episode. I read all of the Oz books as a kid and loved them. This episode seemed to think that just name-dropping would be sufficient. It’s a cop-out if the only characteristic Dorothy shares with the girl in the books is the name Dorothy. And Dorothy was clearly based on Mila Kunis’ character from the recent Oz movie – problem being, that movie was fairly bad and MK’s flat, monotone delivery was one of the worst parts of it so why copy that? And if Dorothy had been in a jar for so long, why did she talk like 2013!Girl? One of the best parts of Time After Time was Dean and Ness constantly being confused by each other’s slang. But Dorothy was just a big ol’ Mary Sue in anaachronistic clothing.
So many deus ex machinas I probably can’t list them all. Oh look, the Lair has a bunch of rooms we haven’t discovered! Hey, Charlie can work on a computer that is unlike any computer anyone has ever seen! Oh yeah, Ezekiel can heal anyone! (And what’s up with Samzekiel’s robotic delivery and lack of contractions? The actual Ezekiel didn’t talk like that.) It’s lazy writing if you just have to keep pulling out a “hey here’s an X that no one’s talked about before and will never be mentioned again but it magically solves this story problem we’ve created.”
I don’t think the writers realize how much it cheapens Dean and Sam when they show that just anyone can become a hunter on a whim. They tried it with Jo and now they are doing it with Charlie. Dude, Dean and Sam grew up in this life, they literally couldn’t have a normal childhood because of it, but now anyone can play hunter and all you need is an iPad and a desire for “something magic” – you don’t even need an EMF meter or salt anymore.
And I know it was just a throwaway line but Im bugged by Charlie’s comment that she discovered her employer was using child labor. If Charlie is supposed to be A) highly principled and B) amazingly intelligent, then how am I supposed to believe she didn’t research a company *before* accepting an offer of employment?
There were a lot of other things that bugged (it was up there with Racist Truck and Sex Dog) but those are the salient points.
I loved it but I did have one reservation. How many more times is it going to be necessary for Dean to ask Zeke to save someone he cares for? First I was upset because, damn it they killed off Charlie, and second I was upset because they pulled the Ezekiel card and had him bring her back to life. I want Charlie to be alive, don’t get me wrong I love her, but I wish they hadn’t played that card so soon or even at all. Unless there is a purpose for it later on in the season I think they shouldn’t have gone there. Maybe down the road Dean will use it to justify what he did by telling Sam if he hadn’t let Zeke possess him then not only would he be dead but Charlie would be as well.
Still all in all I really enjoyed it. I would have been cool to see Sam and Dean try to fight off a flying monkey but sometimes less is more.
Special effects…top notch as always. Loved the additional sets. I would love it if they included in the season nine dvd’s a video tour on all the various sets involved with the Men of Letters bunker. Wouldn’t that be cool?
I LOVED this episode! I loved everything and everyone in it! The story was great, everyone’s performances were great, the vfx were great (loved the peeks into Oz!), we got to explore the Bunker some more (Sam’s room! the kitchen! and the GARAGE! – such great work creating all these!), the AC/DC at the end rocked, and Sam did call the Bunker home at the end, didn’t he? 🙂 I’m full of squee right now! This was MAGIC!!
Loved this episode! It had so many great references, it had me geeking the whole way through. Loved Dean saying, “I just cleaned this place” and Sam’s bitchface, priceless! 😆 We finally got to see Sam’s room, his explanation about why he doesn’t want to call it home was so sad 😥 , but then at the end he says “There’s no place like home” 🙄 Charlie! so happy to see her again, but then, she died and it being Supernatural, came back. Thank God, because I was getting ready to write a hate filled letter to TPTB. But, then again I agree that we need to lay off the Deus ex machina trend, and Sam is finally realizing that something is up. How long before the poop hits the fan? And AC/DC at the end! Anything with AC/DC makes it that much better! 😛
Now, on to the episode with Dean as a dog!!! WTF? 😕
I’m simply going to say that I now think this episode goes down as the worst SPN episode to date. I hated it. The dialogue was awful and the acting was clunky, save Mark Sheppard’s scene. (Sorry, JA, but even you couldn’t pull this one out of the garbage.)
Nowadays, I cringe when I see Robbie Thompson is writing a script, because (1) I know it was written to show just how AWESOME Charlie is, and (2) the episode will be pointless, because Charlie is pointless in the SPNverse.
I’m glad there are some that enjoy Thompson and his Charlie worship, but I am off to mourn the SPN that used to be – the clever writing, the interesting story about the love of family, the horror that was scary, and the funny that was actually funny. I do give thanks that the eye candy is still in the show. I’ll watch it for that.
This was a fun episode; Felicia Day should keep Robbie Thompson on retainer – he does a great job writing for Charlie. It’s always a little dangerous when Supernatural takes on these types of episodes but somehow they manage to pull it off. I’m loving the expanded MOL bunker; Jerry Wanek and his team have done an outstanding job. The VFX team did some great work as well, though it looks like they used up the budget for a couple of episodes on this one 🙂
A couple of issues; having Zeke save someone every episode is getting old. In earlier seasons, you knew Sam and Dean wouldn’t die, at least for long, so other characters dying had some meaning or significance. Nowadays, you haven’t earned your street cred on SPN unless you died and were brought back at least once. I hope they wrap up the Sam/Zeke thing by midseason; Dean’s lies are becoming a house of cards; Sam has been questioning small things every episode so far so it can’t be long before he starts putting things together; otherwise it makes Sam look like an idiot. Also hope Crowley gets out of the dungeon soon, though I suspect they have some stuff in mind for him later this season and this current story line works well with Mark Sheppard’s schedule on other shows.
[quote]the wiener Angel…can’t remember his name.[/quote]
Samandriel for the useless fact of the day.
[quote]First I was upset because, damn it they killed off Charlie, and second I was upset because they pulled the Ezekiel card and had him bring her back to life. I want Charlie to be alive, don’t get me wrong I love her, but I wish they hadn’t played that card so soon or even at all. Unless there is a purpose for it later on in the season I think they shouldn’t have gone there. [/quote]
I do agree that Zeke resurrecting people is getting to be a bit much. However, in this case, they needed and excuse as to why Zeke, angel who is able to expel three demons, can’t take on one Wicked Witch and keep Sam from having a three way in his head. So save Charlie, make Zeke “too weak” to keep the WW out and move on.
[quote]Now, on to the episode with Dean as a dog!!! WTF? :-?[/quote]
I am officially annoyed by this. Dean who has set the unalterable rule of “No Dogs”, who made a big case about Sam even permitting a dog in the Impala gets to communicate with dogs? While Sam, the kid who has wanted a dog at least twice in his life gets bupkis? Dean, who gets to talk to everyone and share his emotions can now add dogs to the list of people and things that will talk to Dean but not Sam? So not fair!
[quote]Nowadays, I cringe when I see Robbie Thompson is writing a script, because (1) I know it was written to show just how AWESOME Charlie is, and (2) the episode will be pointless, because Charlie is pointless in the SPNverse.[/quote]
I don’t cringe, but yeah, I wish he wrote more than Charlie the Good. I looked at what RT has written and out of eight episodes, FOUR of his are all centered on Charlie, which is a bit much for me. I like Charlie, but she does tend to be Super!Charlie a LOT.
[quote]Now, I”m going to say something a bit controversial. I love Robbie Thompson’s dialog, storylines, and characters other than Sam and Dean. I’m not sure he enjoys writing Sam and Dean and I don’t think he does a great job writing real Sam and Dean or maybe just Sam. This is his list of episodes
So I’m torn. I like Robby Thompson as a writer for many reasons, but I end up feeling something is lacking in his episodes.[/quote]
I posted before reading the comments, but I want to say you are not alone in your misgivings about Thompson. After this episode and for the first time ever, I’m going to not watch Thompson-written episodes, and I don’t even do that with Lemming-Buckner. I just can’t take any more of his Charlie worship.
Robbie Thompson simply didn’t go far enough in Sams scenes…its like he wrote up to somethng intersting nad then stopped. Sams refusing to see the bunker as home. Honestly? I would have gone further. Dean adn JOhn have idealized their preseries home life to such a degree that Sam is trying to attain it … or at least that feeling. Its unattainable obviously but John for 22 years have told Sam (and Dean) that this was what they were working for.
Sams descion of “No place like home’ turn around was unearned. We needed more depth to his isse.
Sam with Sam and Charlies scene. Charlie wants a quest. Sam says quests suck. Go further…why do they suck. You die, you watch helpless as loved ones die, friends die, and you are unable to stop it or do anything about it (unless you are dean). Charlie needed her rose colored glasses taken off.
Chalrie ended up going to Oz simply for plot reasons. She would have insisted on knowing how she was brought back; dean would have had to tell her about Zeke. And i hope to God Charlie had/has enough respect for Sam to tell Dean that Sam deserved the truth and deserved it from Dean.
Right now i’m upset not only because Dean is lying to Sam but that Dean thinks so little of Sam that he thinks Sam is stupid enough to beleive all his lies.
I’m beyond over the Angel possession; i’m over the lies, anbd im tired of Sam being knocked unconcious every episode. Shouldn’t Sam be thinking he’s a liability by now? That and his memory lapses are more a danger to Dean? And Dean swoooping in and killing everything without a scratch….its obvious Dean doesn’t need Sam around. he can do everything himself these days.
And why was Dean and Charlie all cuddled up on Sams bed? Sam doesn’t get his bed but is regulated to a chair? He looked so outside looking in. I felt bad for him.
This kind of story isn’t for me. I like scy-fi/ fantasy shows as close to reality as possible. Sounds crazy, I know, but when they start leaning too much on fantasy, they loose me. I like when things are believable/plausible, as mad as it may seem. A la X-files, or the begining of Fringe, before the whole crazy multi universe stuff.
I can buy fantasy with angels, demons, God, Heaven, Hell, Purgatory, Monsters and Ghosts. It ties with the creation, religion, what happens when you die etc. The mysteries of life since day One, for which we don’t have an answer.
But when they introduce an alternative dimension that is fairy land, or Oz, it becomes too much for me. I’m sorry, but I can’t buy it as believable. Either is all fantasy, and I can enjoy it for what it is, or it is fantasy reality based and they have to be careful to not cross the line too much. They did with fairy land.
But hey, it’s me. I enjoyed the rest of the episode: Sam’s thoughts, the bunker, Sam’s room, what he shared with Dean and Charlie, although I can’t see her as a hunter because I can’t picture her as a killer. She’s more peace and love, and I like her for it.
Zeke ressurecting Charlie was needed plot wise, but unecessary for the possession story. I already know he is weak, that is why he is taking so long to heal Sam, and I know that using his powers, like when ressurecting Cass, weakens him, reason he has to stay longer in Sam. And I already know Dean is conflicted, getting dependable on Zeke and getting lost in his lies. Sam better start pressing Dean for answers.
[quote]Sams descion of “No place like home’ turn around was unearned. We needed more depth to his isse.[/quote]
I’m not totally convinced that Sam saying “No place like home” DOES mean he had a turn around on the bunker being home. Dean was mourning losing Charlie. Dean wants Sam to see the bunker as home. Charlie is part of the family. So saying she’ll come back because “There’s no place like home” reassures Dean that Charlie will be back; uses a quote from Wizard of Oz, which is on all their minds, and acknowledges that Dean and possibly their “little sister” Charlie think of the bunker as home. Plus, Sam’s there’s no place like home quote, is said in the garage, in front of the Impala the only home Sam ever really had. They probably want us to believe Sam sees the bunker as home, but he really never said that and it’s open to interpretation.
I am going to quote a few things from Hey Don’t Judge Me’s review of this episode http://heydontjudgeme.com/2013/10/30/supernatural-9-04-slumber-party/ because I liked them.
[quote]Sam, on the other hand, is worried about their other child, Castiel. He doesn’t get why he left them. Dean stumblingly reiterates that Castiel thought they’d be safer without him around. Which makes no sense to Sam, but whatever. Sam at least has a plan to help Castiel stay out of harm’s way; he remembered that Kevin mentioned the table going full-on Light Bright when the angels fell, and Sam has (somehow) figured out that the lights weren’t individual angels, but clusters and if they can get it to work it’ll be a flashing “do not go to this place, Castiel” detector.
Except right now it doesn’t work, which is great if you’re Dean. Imagine if it did work? There’d be a flashing angel on the premises indicator going off right in the bunker and Sam would be spinning around like a dog chasing its tail trying to figure it out. Sam wants it up and running though and Dean can’t voice a good reason not to.[/quote]
and
[quote]Dean is baffled that Sam would want to read the books. I mean, books? Without pretty pictures? Who does that, right? Not Dean “I reference Kurt Vonnegut and Harper Lee” Winchester. No. Of course not. Let’s pretend that never happened, shall we?[/quote]
I did notice this, it is apparently one of the “Dean never reads weeks”. I’m sure Dean will be literate again when they want him to be and when they want to show Sam is a crummy brother because he never remembers Dean reads, just like the writers.
[quote]because Charlie is going back to Oz with Dorothy. They open the door with the key (and no spell, because only witches need spells) and walk on through to the other side.[/quote]
Yes, I did notice this as well. For a normally pretty tight writer there were some disconcerting holes in this episode.
I’m with Ale (24) here. Other seasons were at least plausible but the show is going off the tracks. Hunting things, saving people. This show needs to get back to the basics and stop trying to shock and amaze us with more fantastical stories. They need to remember that it was the simplicity of the basic story that made it so amazing. Just my opinion.
#25. The spell the witch needed was to bring her minions over to her side of the door. She didn’t need it to go thru the door back to Oz, the key alone worked to open the door and allow passage back.
[quote]
Yes, I did notice this as well. For a normally pretty tight writer there were some disconcerting holes in this episode.[/quote]
If the witch already did the spell, shouldn’t the key still work?
[quote]Dude, I haaaaaated this episode. I read all of the Oz books as a kid and loved them. This episode seemed to think that just name-dropping would be sufficient. It’s a cop-out if the only characteristic Dorothy shares with the girl in the books is the name Dorothy. And Dorothy was clearly based on Mila Kunis’ character from the recent Oz movie – problem being, that movie was fairly bad and MK’s flat, monotone delivery was one of the worst parts of it so why copy that? And if Dorothy had been in a jar for so long, why did she talk like 2013!Girl? One of the best parts of Time After Time was Dean and Ness constantly being confused by each other’s slang. But Dorothy was just a big ol’ Mary Sue in anaachronistic clothing.[/quote]
She was nothing like Mila Kunis in Oz the Great an Powerful. I don’t see how her clothes were anachronistic, they had pants in the ’30s.
[quote]So many deus ex machinas I probably can’t list them all. Oh look, the Lair has a bunch of rooms we haven’t discovered! Hey, Charlie can work on a computer that is unlike any computer anyone has ever seen! Oh yeah, Ezekiel can heal anyone! (And what’s up with Samzekiel’s robotic delivery and lack of contractions? The actual Ezekiel didn’t talk like that.) It’s lazy writing if you just have to keep pulling out a “hey here’s an X that no one’s talked about before and will never be mentioned again but it magically solves this story problem we’ve created.” [/quote]
That the Bunker a lot of rooms we haven’t, is really dumb complaint. That’s like complaining that Dean found a bedroom, because we didn’t see it before.
Charlie is a computer, it’s not out of the realm of possibility that she has knowledge about old computer system, hell she name dropped Ada Lovelace.
Yes Ezekiel can heal anyone, and it comes at a cost as he has said and shown. As for Sazekiel’s line delivery, Jared actually played Ezekiel first since they had shoot the second episode first. So if you gotta be mad at any inconsistency with the acting, it should probably go to Tahmoh Penikett, I guess. Even though I don’t see much of difference in the performance.
[quote]I don’t think the writers realize how much it cheapens Dean and Sam when they show that just anyone can become a hunter on a whim. They tried it with Jo and now they are doing it with Charlie. Dude, Dean and Sam grew up in this life, they literally couldn’t have a normal childhood because of it, but now anyone can play hunter and all you need is an iPad and a desire for “something magic” – you don’t even need an EMF meter or salt anymore.[/quote]
That’s usually how most hunters have come to be on the show, they witness something supernatural, it changes their life, they go into hunting.
Sam and Dean are the somewhat rare exception.
Yes because we didn’t see Charlie use an EMF meter or salt, in an episode that did not call for its use, mean that she theoretically never used it in her ghost hunting excursion.
I really like Jared, but his acting as Samzekiel is so bad that I keep expecting him to say, “If there’s a key, then there has to be a lock.” Actually, since Samzekiel doesn’t use contractions (even though Realzekiel talked like, you know, a normal person) “If there is a key, then there has to be a lock.”
I think I’ve gotten spoiled by having the first 8 seasons on tap via Netflix. I can pick and choose the good episodes and skip the stinkers. It’s easy to forget that at least half the episodes of SPN – maybe two-thirds – are stinkers. Fortunately, when this show is good, it’s REALLY good.
This is one of the most hilarious reviews I’ve ever read here.
Excellent!
I not sure who Realzekiel is ? as Jared created the character from scratch and I cannot see much wrong with what he is doing , he has to make the character distinct from Sam. But as the old adage says you cant please everybody.
[quote]I not sure who Realzekiel is ? as Jared created the character from scratch and I cannot see much wrong with what he is doing , he has to make the character distinct from Sam. But as the old adage says you cant please everybody.[/quote]
Jared didn’t create the chracter of Ezekiel from scratch. He was originally played by Tahmoh Penikett, who spoke non-robotically and used contractions. (Parenthetically, I hope we get to see TP again at some point on the show, he has the most soothing voice I’ve ever heard.)
[quote][quote]I not sure who Realzekiel is ? as Jared created the character from scratch and I cannot see much wrong with what he is doing , he has to make the character distinct from Sam. But as the old adage says you cant please everybody.[/quote]
Jared didn’t create the chracter of Ezekiel from scratch. He was originally played by Tahmoh Penikett, who spoke non-robotically and used contractions. (Parenthetically, I hope we get to see TP again at some point on the show, he has the most soothing voice I’ve ever heard.)[/quote]
Actually, episode two was shot first, so Jared did play Ezekiel first. So the character was his to interpret.
[quote][quote]I not sure who Realzekiel is ? as Jared created the character from scratch and I cannot see much wrong with what he is doing , he has to make the character distinct from Sam. But as the old adage says you cant please everybody.[/quote]
Jared didn’t create the chracter of Ezekiel from scratch. He was originally played by Tahmoh Penikett, who spoke non-robotically and used contractions. (Parenthetically, I hope we get to see TP again at some point on the show, he has the most soothing voice I’ve ever heard.)[/quote]
Joni – actually, JP played Zeke first; the first two episodes were filmed out of order (because of actor availability, 9.02 was filmed first, 9.01 second) so chronologically, JP played Zeke first.
[quote][quote]
Yes, I did notice this as well. For a normally pretty tight writer there were some disconcerting holes in this episode.[/quote]
If the witch already did the spell, shouldn’t the key still work?[/quote]
The spell had nothing to do with opening the door; it was to summon her minions to the world she was in.
Then it’s bad writing. We shouldn’t have to resort to the explanation that the episodes were filmed out of order to explain the weirdly stilted dialogue. (And I suppose it’s more the writers’ fault than Jared’s, anyway.)
One of the biggest failings of the writing on this show is that they don’t understand “show, don’t tell.” Sam would still be angel-posessed if he didn’t talk like that, because they’ve already established that that is a thing, but apparently a) having knowledge of previous episodes and b) showing the blue eye-flash when Zeke takes over are not enough.
P.S. The fact that she has now died and come bck to life earns Charlie another point on the Mary Sue Litmus Test 😆
I agree with your commenting of the pacing of the episode . I also not crazy about the Zeke story line. I am not fond of Zeke healing everyone. Getting old. But I like Robbie’s episodes Basically just enjoying the ride awaiting the outcome.
[quote]Then it’s bad writing. We shouldn’t have to resort to the explanation that the episodes were filmed out of order to explain the weirdly stilted dialogue. (And I suppose it’s more the writers’ fault than Jared’s, anyway.)
One of the biggest failings of the writing on this show is that they don’t understand “show, don’t tell.” Sam would still be angel-posessed if he didn’t talk like that, because they’ve already established that that is a thing, but apparently a) having knowledge of previous episodes and b) showing the blue eye-flash when Zeke takes over are not enough.[/quote]
I look at it like Zeke was comfortable in the first body, which was healthy. He can use the memories and thoughts of the first guy to be more human.
When he took over Sam he was basically in a human corpse, Sam was mostly dead. it was a bit like a puppet trying to hold himself up using his own strings. So Zeke was stiff, awkward and stilted. The first time we see him as Sam he is all Ezekiel.
With later possessions he is more human because Sam is doing better and he is learning how to deal with Dean because he understands Sam.
If Jared played Zeke as more human the gripes would be that people can’t tell the difference between Sam and Zeke (as opposed to Tamoah who is only required to play one character) …
As Misha pointed out, Cas is the original angel and literally no-one else who has played an angel has made any effort to resemble Cas’s angel characteristics, except Jared playing Zeke. I feel that that the people on the show longest and who know SPN the best are the ones doing it right.
Listening to Jared he has clearly put a lot of thought into how to do this and not come over as Lucifer. He is doing an absolutely excellent job portraying two (and last night 3) different characters at the snap of his fingers.
The ‘Zeke!’ moment was the most suspension-of-disbelief bit of last night’s episode for me 🙂
And Sam following through with ‘Who is Zeke?’ was great to see.
Wow, I’m so conflicted on this episode. It was nowhere near what I expected – the teaser was much funnier and cooler looking than the actual show. I was distanced from the story because the pacing was off. On first viewing, I was really underwhelmed and disappointed, with moments I loved. On second viewing, either my expectations were really low, or I can just enjoy SPN more when I know what’s coming, because I liked this at lot more. And as I write this, I realize I liked more than I didn’t. I think the teaser put my expectations way too high.
My biggest beef was Dorothy – on paper, so cool. Reality? Wow, the actress was bad. Every time she was onscreen, I was totally distracted watching her act. The scenes with Dorothy and Charlie were striking because Charlie sparkles onscreen (and no, I’m not talking about Felicity’s lighting). Felicity has so much personality and chemistry. Dorothy’s portrayal was washed out in color and in B&W. Dorothy was particularly jarring compared to the witch – that actress was a hoot! Talk about creating a character without using words. Her scene with Crawley awesome and
I’m tiring of Charlie, I think. Not the character – I love her optimistic, sunny and enthusiastic approach, particularly against the weary and cynical Winchesters. But the situations she’s in when we see her – too much fantasy, I think? Or too forced? Too often? I’m not sure but I think they need to watch how they use her.
Of course my favorite parts were the “curtain fic” aspects, even tinged as SPN always is by sadness and gloomy overtones (Dean loves it, Sam’s meh on it, somehow we know it won’t last). I loved the look at the bunker – the kitchen, the garage, Sam’s room – Sam’s room! – the computer room. I loved the scene wherethey figured out the computer. So perfectly representing the two brothers’ personalities – Sam, methodically following cables to find out where they lead. Dean, feeling it up and banging and then damn near breaking the thing. I liked the brotherly arguing/snarking about normal things: messy bedrooms, what constitutes “home”, Dean being offended that the MoL lair isn’t “nice enough for the poster.” It’s rare to see these guys having those purely (or mostly purely) brotherly moments. And Jared doing some comedy – the “no bells” scene re:BeckyWinchester176 was maybe the funniest Sam moment ever.
I like the idea of Dean being addicted to using Zeke, although I too am growing weary of Dean invoking Zeke to save his loved ones. I keep thinking that SPN (almost) never plays things this heavy-handed without a reason so I think there’s some larger reason behind Dean needing to save so many people. I hope. Or it could end up like Amelia and Sam not searching for Dean – a big issue for fans, but not a big deal for the Show. I’m still hoping Zeke is not a bad guy, though. I’m expecting this to go nuclear on Dean, and Sam will be righteously and rightfully pissed.
One of the things I want to understand – does Sam not see a home for himself, or just no home until he’s out of the life? Because last year he kinda got a home with Amelia, and then he said he could see a light at the end of the tunnel and would take Dean there, but now he doesn’t have/want a home? Maybe there’s no home, just a tunnel. And if there’s a tunnel, must there also be a light?
Finally a plea to the PWTB and whoever picks the opening backstory clips. Please Show. Stop with the keys and the locks and so on. You. Are. Killing. Me.
One thing – shouldn’t Dean be worried that when they get the “angel radar” working, the first angel they locate will be Ezekiel? That’s going to be hard to explain…
[quote]One of the things I want to understand – does Sam not see a home for himself, or just no home until he’s out of the life? Because last year he kinda got a home with Amelia, and then he said he could see a light at the end of the tunnel and would take Dean there, but now he doesn’t have/want a home? Maybe there’s no home, just a tunnel. And if there’s a tunnel, must there also be a light?[/quote]
I think that for Sam both time he had a home it blew up spectacularly. He was settling in with Jess, planning to ask her to marry him, building a home then she dies burning on the ceiling. He makes a home with Amelia, cobbling together a life without Dean. Then Amelia’s dead husband turns out to not be dead. Sam has to leave his home behind and it turns out Dean wasn’t dead, so his entire home was built on the failure to look for Dean and therefore on Dean’s suffering in Purgatory and then on Dean’s condemnation of Sam giving up on him “for a girl”. For Sam the homes he has tried to build ended in guilt and sorrow. I do think that for Sam he will never trust a home unless he is truly out of the life, which probably means never.
[quote]
My biggest beef was Dorothy – on paper, so cool. Reality? Wow, the actress was bad. Every time she was onscreen, I was totally distracted watching her act. The scenes with Dorothy and Charlie were striking because Charlie sparkles onscreen (and no, I’m not talking about Felicity’s lighting). Felicity has so much personality and chemistry. Dorothy’s portrayal was washed out in color and in B&W. Dorothy was particularly jarring compared to the witch – that actress was a hoot! Talk about creating a character without using words. Her scene with Crawley awesome[/quote]
I don’t usually say bad things about the acting because the worst actor in the world (Sam and Dean jointly in The French Mistake) would be a better actor than me, but I have to say I am glad someone else reacted the same way as me to Dorothy 😕 I was thinking it was just me…
Jensen (or Jared?) said at the last con that they had an actress recently who was having trouble with them going from goofing off off-camera to being all serious in character and I can’t help wondering if it was the actress playing Dorothy?
[quote][quote]One of the things I want to understand – does Sam not see a home for himself, or just no home until he’s out of the life? Because last year he kinda got a home with Amelia, and then he said he could see a light at the end of the tunnel and would take Dean there, but now he doesn’t have/want a home? Maybe there’s no home, just a tunnel. And if there’s a tunnel, must there also be a light?[/quote]
I think that for Sam both time he had a home it blew up spectacularly. He was settling in with Jess, planning to ask her to marry him, building a home then she dies burning on the ceiling. He makes a home with Amelia, cobbling together a life without Dean. Then Amelia’s dead husband turns out to not be dead. Sam has to leave his home behind and it turns out Dean wasn’t dead, so his entire home was built on the failure to look for Dean and therefore on Dean’s suffering in Purgatory and then on Dean’s condemnation of Sam giving up on him “for a girl”. For Sam the homes he has tried to build ended in guilt and sorrow. I do think that for Sam he will never trust a home unless he is truly out of the life, which probably means never.[/quote]
Any other place Sam has called home has also been destroyed. The Impala, Bobby’s house and the home that Dean remembers that Sam doesn’t (but that Sam sees through the damage that loss has done to Dean) have all been destroyed. Anyone who has had that happen to them 100% of the times they started to put down roots would definitely say ‘ok if I don’t treat this place as home it might actually be a safe place for me.’
Someone was saying earlier that Sam’s sudden ‘home’ issues were contrived for the episode. From my point of view it is so completely clear why Sam wouldn’t treat the bunker s home that I can’t understand why they devoted the precious minute and a half of Sam character development that we get every 10 episodes or so to this one point – and they made it three times no less…Show we have been watching for 9 seasons, we know what makes the boys tick!
I guess Show could be saying that Sam has come around to the bunker as home and he will have put up Justin Bieber posters in his room by next week (and as a result be sleeping on the sofa in the library) but I think that his comment at the end about ‘no place like home’ was principally to make Dean feel better over the loss of Charlie.
[quote]I guess Show could be saying that Sam has come around to the bunker as home and he will have put up Justin Bieber posters in his room by next week (and as a result be sleeping on the sofa in the library) but I think that his comment at the end about ‘no place like home’ was principally to make Dean feel better over the loss of Charlie.[/quote]
I agree that Sam was making Dean feel better about losing Charlie, not really accepting the bunker as home.
[quote]This kind of story isn’t for me. I like scy-fi/ fantasy shows as close to reality as possible. Sounds crazy, I know, but when they start leaning too much on fantasy, they loose me. I like when things are believable/plausible, as mad as it may seem. A la X-files, or the begining of Fringe, before the whole crazy multi universe stuff.
I can buy fantasy with angels, demons, God, Heaven, Hell, Purgatory, Monsters and Ghosts. It ties with the creation, religion, what happens when you die etc. The mysteries of life since day One, for which we don’t have an answer.
But when they introduce an alternative dimension that is fairy land, or Oz, it becomes too much for me. I’m sorry, but I can’t buy it as believable. Either is all fantasy, and I can enjoy it for what it is, or it is fantasy reality based and they have to be careful to not cross the line too much. They did with fairy land.[/quote]
Hi Ale,
Oh man, you took the words right out of my mouth!! I was trying to figure out why I really didn’t care for this episode, and then I read your post and thought, “that’s it exactly!” Too much fantasy… not enough reality. I too like it when the mystical elements of this show are firmly grounded in the reality of the brother’s and their situations and reactions to things. Therefore, I had a lot of trouble with this episode. I didn’t hate it, but I had a hard time caring; OZ? really? Why? With Angels falling and snagging vessels left and right, and Bart amassing an angel force, Metatron controlling Heaven, Abbadon trying to retake Hell, Crowley in their basement and Zeke all up in Sam’s business why do we care about OZ or Dorothy or the admittedly awesome Wicked Witch of the West at all? What did they tell us about the Winchesters, or the Supernatural world and all the current plots? Nothing that I could see. I don’t mind a one off episode, but even those need to inform the brother’s current struggle. The MOL information didn’t give us ANY insight into how they worked as a group to fight demons before they were defeated in 1958, nothing that was relevant to Sam and Dean’s current struggle was found; knowing there is an OZ doesn’t help at all in the “now” of the show’s current set of plot lines, so I couldn’t help wondering why were even going there? What was the point?
And I agree with Percysowner and several other posters that I’ve seen enough of Zeke saving the day and Sam unconscious on the floor. I love the whole Samsekiel conundrum, but I am currently seeing the problem of Cas as Deus ex Machina just completely transferred over to Zeke. The show still has the problem of a Mr. Fix-it in their midst. And Sam needs to really start questioning things more; he’s coming across as unbelievably naive and unaware, which is NOT the smart, suspicious Sammy that I know and love. Sam questions everything, so he needs to get to it as it’s becoming increasingly unrealistic that he would continually wake up on the floor in a stupor and accept that Dean killed three demons, saved Charlie, saved Cas all while he was unconscious. And I kept waiting for the connections between Oz and the current issues going on in the Supernatural world right now, but there weren’t any. Oz was just Oz and totally removed and separate from the world Sam and Dean inhabit, so I had a hard time caring about Oz, or the incredibly wooden Dorothy and her Daddy issues for that matter. If Dorothy’s daddy issues had reflected back to either Sam OR Dean in some way, I possibly could have bought into what was going on more. But Alas!
And Charlie gets to go to OZ at the end of the ep? Ugh… just… no, what a weird kind of cop-out that was. She knows too much so we have to get rid of her, but the fans will skin us alive if she dies, so lets kill her to make Dean sad for two seconds, then have Samzekiel revive her and then send her off to OZ. Not diggin’ that ending too much. Why did she have to find out that she’d died anyway? Why not keep her in the dark and then send her back out to continue her hunter training so that we can see her again in a later episode? The whole ‘Chalie gets to go have an adventure in Oz’ was just too much for my suspension of disbelief that I guess won’t suspend quite that far.
Things I did like: The Wicked Witch, she was awesome and a true character without ever saying a word. The expanded MOL complex, that place is getting increasingly awesome, Sam’s room; it’s stark and undecorated because Sam doesn’t believe in home, and doesn’t even care that he’s got an uncomfortable bed! :cry:. The brotherly banter and how well Sam and Dean are connecting at the moment too bad it’s all based on lies, lies LIES!!!! 😥 😥
[quote] And Sam needs to really start questioning things more; he’s coming across as unbelievably naive and unaware, which is NOT the smart, suspicious Sammy that I know and love. Sam questions everything, so he needs to get to it as it’s becoming increasingly unrealistic that he would continually wake up on the floor in a stupor and accept that Dean killed three demons, saved Charlie, saved Cas all while he was unconscious.[/quote]
The thing is, they have a really good explanation for Sam not asking questions, if they were willing to work a little. I could totally buy that Sam is afraid that the insanity that Cas removed from him is coming back because Cas is no longer an angel. If he were afraid that the missing time and Dean questioning his ability to come up with good ideas like the angel locator are because he is blacking out and seeing Lucifer and Dean is “protecting” him it would fit nicely into Sam’s past. Sadly, I think they will stick with Sam the suddenly oblivious instead.
[quote]One thing – shouldn’t Dean be worried that when they get the “angel radar” working, the first angel they locate will be Ezekiel? That’s going to be hard to explain…[/quote]
No kidding! Although Sam did say it was detecting clusters of angels falling so maybe one angel isn’t enough to show up. I dunno, we’ll see what happens when/if they actually use it. Although Dean should be more worried that Cas calls Sam and they compare reasons why he left …
I don’t think Cas would say that he left because Dean told him to. He would give Sam the same explanation Dean gave. After all, Cas is the one who ran to keep Leviathans away from Dean in Purgatory – he would buy into the ” you’re a beacon for pissed off fallen angels and a danger to your friends” line of thought. What Dean really should be worried about is Cas talking about Sam’s stay in the hospital and Ezekiel’s presence there.
About Sam asking questions – he has been doing that since the very beginning.
“You’ve been driving around with me passed out in the passenger’s seat for a day?” “You took out three demons alone?” ” How did you know where to find Cas?” “Who’s Zeke?” For every question Sam has asked, he has gotten one of two responses : deflection or more blatant lies. Dean is not someone who will give real answers if he doesn’t want to.
Sam definitely knows that something is up, but he has no clear idea what it is. He also knows his brother well enough not to confront him unless he has something to confront him with. Remember “All Hell Breaks Loose part II”? Sam was able to confront Dean because he had guessed that Dean had made a crossroads deal. Dean only stopped trying to deflect when Sam specifically asked him about selling his soul and demanded to be told the truth.There’s also “A Very Supernatural Christmas”, where Dean only told Sam the truth about the family business once Sam had already read John’s journal.
This time, Sam has no way of guessing that he’s hosting an angel, because it contradicts what he knows about angels and about Dean. He doesn’t remember saying yes, he thinks of angels in general as superpowered dicks and bodysnatchers, and he has heard Dean refer to them as dicks often enough.He has also seen Dean resist Zachariah’s bullying and refuse to be an “angel condom”. How could Sam guess that Dean had prayed for help, that an angel has answered and is now residing in his body without his knowledge and consent?
Marching up to Dean and demanding answers won’t do him any good. Sam will probably grow increasingly suspicious and find everything out before confronting Dean.
[quote][quote]One thing – shouldn’t Dean be worried that when they get the “angel radar” working, the first angel they locate will be Ezekiel? That’s going to be hard to explain…[/quote]
No kidding! Although Sam did say it was detecting clusters of angels falling so maybe one angel isn’t enough to show up. I dunno, we’ll see what happens when/if they actually use it. Although Dean should be more worried that Cas calls Sam and they compare reasons why he left …[/quote]
Sam or Castiel calling eachother? why would they do that? Its not like they are friends or anything. (sarcasm). Neither guy will talk to the other unless Dean is present to initiate contact. I think this storyline is highly indicative of proof that Sam and Cas are NOT friends in their own right. And I’m sorry but this is in no way a “TEAM” Each member of the team should interact independantly of each other and together.
[quote][quote]…He also knows his brother well enough not to confront him unless he has something to confront him with. Remember […] Sam was able to confront Dean because he had guessed that Dean had made a crossroads deal. […] there’s also “A Very Supernatural Christmas”, where Dean only told Sam the truth about the family business once Sam had already read John’s journal. [/quote]
I only meant to pop in for a second… so I haven’t had time to think this through… but it instinctively is striking a chord for me. Dean can be very “parental” with truth and “misdirection”. Both fellas, but especially Sam, have talked about how they wish Dad had protected them from “the truth” a bit more. There are no monsters in the closet. Santa and the Tooth Fairy are real… and good. Parents have to determine what “little white lies” it would be almost irresponsible to NOT tell their children, and most children will eventually “get that” and forgive… vs. what lies would constitute a long-term damaging breach of trust. If Sam hasn’t largely figured out some “unpleasant something” already, Dean will deflect or make up prettier truths. But if Sam has got a pretty decent sense of what’s happened/happening, Dean comes clean so as not to break the trust. He won’t “bald-faced lie”, so to speak… but he’ll “tell tales”. At least the Dean we’re seeing right now exhibits that type of behavior towards the Sam we’re seeing right now (giggle).[/quote]
Problem is Sam isn’t 5 years old any more. Or even 10 or 15. He’s a 30 year old man. And weather Dean is playing Daddy or big brother, Sam deserves the respect of honesty about all this.
I’m not going to focus too much on the episode (mainly because the episode was nothing but Charlie who, at this stage, makes me want to rip out my eyes and ears so that I need never see her nor hear her ever again) but on one or two things other things that came from the episode.
Re: Sam not feeling like the bunker is home. That doesn’t surprise me. One of the things that has defined Sam, and it was commented on again last season, is Sam’s ability to differentiate between work and home. He doesn’t want to bring work home, or make them the one. Sam not making the bunker his home ties in with that. So I’m rather glad they didn’t go down that easy peasy ‘Yes, it’s totally my home’ route.
Add to that, apart from what Sam said about it not feeling like home to him (his homes are usually associated with death, betrayal, loss and destruction), home is generally where you spend the most time, where you feel safe and the place where Sam has spent the most time is in the Cage. Admittedly he wasn’t exactly ‘safe’ there but neither has he been safe in any of the other ‘homes’ that he’s had. The bunker, despite all its protections, epitomises much of what is ‘unsafe’ for Sam. It’s steeped in the supernatural, they have a demon in their bunker, it’s been home to a god, there have been witches running around it, there are keys to alternative dimensions just lying about the place, Abbadon knows of its existence and is presumably once again looking for it, there are people trapped literally within its walls, there’s an angel and a prophet living there and Castiel, who is on quite a few hit lists will undoubtedly be back soon. Add to that, as we saw from Charlie that any half able computer geek could track them down. Realistically, the bunker is probably the least safe place they’ve ever lived. However, with the Cage, what was not safe was also known and expected but there is untold and unknown danger that comes with them living in the bunker. Hell, they would probably be safer in some abandoned shack because at least there, they have anonymity.
Now while Dean thrives in that sort of situation (and we saw in this episode, with where he stored the key, that he actively surrounds himself in this type of mystery) I’m not surprised that Sam doesn’t, and his declaration that the bunker wasn’t his home and his minimalist room reflects that. He surrounds himself with what he has always surrounded himself with then he tries to feel safe; knowledge, not trinkets.
Furthermore, while Ezekiel is possessing Sam, I don’t particularly want Sam to feel at home there. It’d be heart wrenching to realise that the bunker, where Sam might feel safe and at home, is actually the scene where the consistent violation of his body and mind is being carried out. It’d be akin to moving into a new house, making it your home and a few months later realising that there is a stranger squirreled away in your attic, watching your every move and interfering with you and your stuff while you slept. How ‘at home’ could you feel there then? To make it worse, the person who persuaded you to buy the house and convinced you it was safe was the person who let this stranger into your sanctuary. What happens to that which was your home then? It’s hard to see the bunker becoming Sam’s home once Ezekiel is known. It would be akin to the apartment where Jessica died or the house in Lawrence where his mother died being considered ‘home’.
And this is what, I feel, Dean needs to understand. Sam can’t just set up home where Dean tells him to set up home. This has to come from Sam, not from Dean. Dean has a tendency to assume that, because he wants/believe something, Sam will follow suit. (And before anyone gets offended, this is not me saying that Dean is selfish or manipulative or whatever the hell. I feel this stems from their childhood where he was [i]expected[/i] to make those decisions and Sam [i]did[/i] follow suit.) From season one, we’ve seen that Sam wants to be his own person, but he also wants Dean to be his own person. However, while the co-dependency of the brothers is still to the fore then I don’t see that happening. Dean refuses to see himself without Sam so neither can Sam be allowed to see himself without Dean. (Again, not an attack on Dean, merely an observation.)
Re Sam remembering that Dean called for ‘Zeke’. It’s strange that Ezekiel didn’t mind-wipe that part. I wonder if Sam is getting stronger (and so is remembering more), Ezekiel is getting weaker (and so can’t mind-wipe as much as he could) or if it’s a clever ploy by Ezekiel, an attempt to force Dean’s hand or something. It’s also notable that, once again, he asked Dean to make a conscious decision, and once again, Dean took the option that took away his brothers will. I wonder if there’s some reason for that ie so Ezekiel can deny culpability if things go wrong with Sam later etc or if it’s to chart Dean’s descent down the road of good intentions.)
Bar wearing Death’s ring, this is the first time that Dean has had this type of power at his fingertips and he is succumbing to it very quickly. It went from using Ezekiel to heal Sam to using him for information, to using him to bring people back from the dead. It’s ironic that he is being lured in by the same thing as Sam was; saving people. (I wonder if Sam/Ezekiel would have been called upon to bring Dorothy (for example) back to life.) Makes you wonder if it was Dean that had the power to exorcise demons back in season 4 would he have been as quick to strike it down or would he have embraced it willingly. It’s a complete turnabout from season 4 when Sam using his powers to save lives was presented as the worst thing Sam could possibly do yet five seasons later it’s a case of Dean using the supernatural powers available to him to save lives.
Contrary to some opinions on here, I don’t think that Sam, given the choice, would allow Ezekiel’s powers (through him) be used to bring someone back from the dead. He has seen, experienced and remembers the ramifications of such actions, we saw him take precautions against it in 9.01 so I don’t think that Sam would have brought Castiel or Charlie back from the dead by his own volition. (So it’s probably just as well that he doesn’t have a choice.) Is that Sam being selfish? Possibly. But it’s also Sam playing it safe with the lives of those who remain.
That being said, the triviality of sacrifice and resurrection on the show in recent episodes is starting to get to me. I know that Sera Gamble was heavily criticised apart back in season 7 when she killed off Bobby but at this stage, for me, a little permanent death would be welcome because it’s farcical the rate that people are dying and immediately being brought back this season. You’d suffer more from a papercut on this show than you would from dying, and the effects would last about as long.
[quote]…..
Sam or Castiel calling eachother? why would they do that? Its not like they are friends or anything. (sarcasm). Neither guy will talk to the other unless Dean is present to initiate contact. I think this storyline is highly indicative of proof that Sam and Cas are NOT friends in their own right. And I’m sorry but this is in no way a “TEAM” Each member of the team should interact independantly of each other and together.[/quote]
I’ve often wondered that myself; if you take Dean out of the equation, would Sam and Castiel be friends? I’m not so sure they would be.
[quote]Re Sam remembering that Dean called for ‘Zeke’. It’s strange that Ezekiel didn’t mind-wipe that part. I wonder if Sam is getting stronger (and so is remembering more), Ezekiel is getting weaker (and so can’t mind-wipe as much as he could) or if it’s a clever ploy by Ezekiel, an attempt to force Dean’s hand or something. It’s also notable that, once again, he asked Dean to make a conscious decision, and once again, Dean took the option that took away his brothers will. I wonder if there’s some reason for that ie so Ezekiel can deny culpability if things go wrong with Sam later etc or if it’s to chart Dean’s descent down the road of good intentions.)
Bar wearing Death’s ring, this is the first time that Dean has had this type of power at his fingertips and he is succumbing to it very quickly. It went from using Ezekiel to heal Sam to using him for information, to using him to bring people back from the dead. It’s ironic that he is being lured in by the same thing as Sam was; saving people. (I wonder if Sam/Ezekiel would have been called upon to bring Dorothy (for example) back to life.) Makes you wonder if it was Dean that had the power to exorcise demons back in season 4 would he have been as quick to strike it down or would he have embraced it willingly. It’s a complete turnabout from season 4 when Sam using his powers to save lives was presented as the worst thing Sam could possibly do yet five seasons later it’s a case of Dean using the supernatural powers available to him to save lives.
Contrary to some opinions on here, I don’t think that Sam, given the choice, would allow Ezekiel’s powers (through him) be used to bring someone back from the dead. He has seen, experienced and remembers the ramifications of such actions, we saw him take precautions against it in 9.01 so I don’t think that Sam would have brought Castiel or Charlie back from the dead by his own volition. (So it’s probably just as well that he doesn’t have a choice.) Is that Sam being selfish? Possibly. But it’s also Sam playing it safe with the lives of those who remain.
That being said, the triviality of sacrifice and resurrection on the show in recent episodes is starting to get to me. I know that Sera Gamble was heavily criticised apart back in season 7 when she killed off Bobby but at this stage, for me, a little permanent death would be welcome because it’s farcical the rate that people are dying and immediately being brought back this season. You’d suffer more from a papercut on this show than you would from dying, and the effects would last about as long.[/quote]
Not so sure it’s as much that Sam is getting stronger; they’ve mentioned in the past that mind wipes can be dangerous so that might factor in to things. Also, it looks like resurrecting people, especially with the frequency with which it’s happening, really drains Zeke’s batteries and he might not have had the juice to do it at that time.
Completely with you on the frequent resurrections and the quick fixes, with Zeke replacing Castiel in that role. There was a lot to criticize in S7 but at least Bobby’s death had some meaning and impact (and it was a damn good episode). Yes, Bobby hung around as a ghost but at least he stayed dead.
As Castiel told Dean in 8.07 A Little Slice of Kevin, “You can’t save everyone, my friend… though, you try” I hope there are real consequences to Dean’s actions (as well intentioned as they have been) later this season, and that it doesn’t get swept under the rug.
[quote]I’ve often wondered that myself; if you take Dean out of the equation, would Sam and Castiel be friends? I’m not so sure they would be.[/quote]
I do agree with this. Many times people are friends with a person but barely interact with their siblings. Sam and Dean’s relationship is more like a marriage, not because of sex, but because they live and work together nearly 24/7. Still married couples often have personal friends that know about the spouse, talk to them in civil and superficial conversations but remain close to their friend and not at all with the spouse. So in many ways Cas only being Dean’s friend and not really Sam’s makes sense.
[quote][quote][quote]One thing – shouldn’t Dean be worried that when they get the “angel radar” working, the first angel they locate will be Ezekiel? That’s going to be hard to explain…[/quote]
No kidding! Although Sam did say it was detecting clusters of angels falling so maybe one angel isn’t enough to show up. I dunno, we’ll see what happens when/if they actually use it. Although Dean should be more worried that Cas calls Sam and they compare reasons why he left …[/quote]
Sam or Castiel calling eachother? why would they do that? Its not like they are friends or anything. (sarcasm). Neither guy will talk to the other unless Dean is present to initiate contact. I think this storyline is highly indicative of proof that Sam and Cas are NOT friends in their own right. And I’m sorry but this is in no way a “TEAM” Each member of the team should interact independantly of each other and together.[/quote]
I disagree yet sort of agree. I think if Dean wasn’t a part of the whole equation that maybe Sam wouldn’t care so much, but at the same time the first thing he says when he realizes the bunker was able to track all the angels falling was, “I think I found a way to help Cas”, not a way to help us but to help Cas. And he seemed genuinely perturbed that Cas thought it better to be out in the world with angels gunning for him. Even in “Meet the New Boss” he’s the one who prayed to Cas because they’d found a way to put the souls back into Purgatory when Dean had clearly given up at that point. Sam even said, “I still think of you as one of us … way, way off the reservation but” so I do think they at least care about each other. Granted, I don’t really think Cas would call Sam directly unless he really needed to but Sam kinda goes with Dean even though he has more of a “profound bond” with Dean. I’m kinda hoping we get some good Cas and Sam moments this season because it’s about time.