WARNING!!! If you haven't seen "The Great Escapist" yet, read no further! There will be lots of spoilery discussion about what happened in this episode. So do yourself a favor and watch it before you head over here and talk about the episode.
I'm back from vacation! And I brought a nasty cold with me, ugh, so I apologize if this is a little rushed or doesn't make sense in places. Bear with me, I guess. I appreciate it!
Ben Edlund strikes again, huh? That was some episode. SO MUCH happened in 40-some odd minutes. Really good stuff. And now I'm dying to see how they resolve everything in 2 more episodes. Or maybe they won't on purpose! At any rate, I've got a theory of the week for you!
Theory Of The Week:
This is kind of in two parts. Part 1: What if the demon they cure is Adam? I want this to happen not because I think it's what they're actually going to do but because I want resolution of Adam's story, damn it! And I want him out of Hell. But think about it. He's been down there an awfully long time now. Maybe it's been long enough to turn him into a demon. Wouldn't it be great if they cure him and send him to heaven to be with his mom?
Part 2: This is what I actually think is going to happen, though. They're going to try and cure Crowley, but the TWIST will be that Crowley isn't actually a demon, so it won't work. They won't be able to close the gates of Hell in the finale. End scene, end season, continue in season 9. Because it would be the ultimate FU to Crowley to make him non-demon, if he is a demon, and forcing him to live on Earth as a nobody again. On the other hand, I'm wondering if it wouldn't be easier to "cure" a low-level demon that isn't very powerful instead of the King of Hell and all that.
And how do you think you cure a demon? My guess: you feed it angel grace. Burn out the demon from the inside. An angel made the first demon, so an angel unmakes a demon. Poetic, no? That's going to be Castiel's sacrifice in the finale. I don't think he'll have to give up all his grace, so he won't fall, but it will be enough to make him substantially weaker.
While you're thinking about those tidbits, let's bullet point the rest of the episode! I made a LOT of notes, so I'll trim some of the fat. But this may still be kind of long.
- "It's me. Now it's wet me."
- Kevin's right, though. What's the point of secret knock if they don't use it? Ah, because it's not the real Sam and Dean. I'm proud to say I got that one before they revealed it. Whoo!
- Scrubbing Kevin's short-term memory, eh? That sounds suspiciously like something Naomi would do.
- How did Crowley get to Kevin in the first place? That boat was super warded. And why didn't the Winchesters pay more attention to Kevin when he said Crowley was in his head? Weirder things have happened to them. I don't think they should have dismissed it so easily.
- Since when does Crowley have Stargates? Or he's been playing too much Portal.
- Awww, Kevin's taped message when he says he's dead. Noooo, that is sad. Also, Kevin, that was really smart of you to set up. Advanced Placement. Kevin, no, don't be sorry. NOOO, all of the Kevin feels.
- Dear Sam and Dean, maybe Kevin's not dead. And here's just a suggestion: if the last time you saw Kevin he was talking about Crowley and stuff, maybe go CHECK that he's dead? You know, just to be sure?
- Oh, Cass. He sits in a Biggerson's. That is really smart. I mean, that's really, really smart. Hey, they showed Pittsburgh! That's where I live!
- Stanford shoutout!!!!
- "You're not really supposed to say Indians."
- Naomi is SCARY when she gets righteous.
- Ooh, Cass has always been disobedient. I like the idea that Cass has always been on the edge of angel society, that he's kind of the thorn in their side because he questions things.
- "In the words of a good friend, "˜bite me.'"
- I thought they had never been to the Grand Canyon, though? Amusing farting donkey story aside, wasn't that something Dean said way back, that he wanted to go because they never had?
- When is the last time we had Native Americans in an episode? "Bugs?"
- Why does Crowley have an angel-killing Luger? Melted-down angel blade bullets. That is super smart.
- Crowley, you sneaky bastard. You have an angel on the payroll? Damn. What DOESN'T Crowley have? Growley. He doesn't have Growley anymore.
- NOOOOOOO, that is not cool, Crowley. You don't gutshot the pretty-boy angels!
- Whoa, Cass put the tablet inside himself. Cass is en pointe this episode! That was so smart.
- Also, Crowley, that was pretty good deductive reasoning, not gonna lie.
- Ooh, Sam, doesn't think he's clean ever since he was a kid. OUCH.
- Sam thinks the trials are purifying him. Called it! Whoo, I got one thing right for once!
- Dean's love of Henleys is fantastic. Never stop wearing those shirts, Dean.
- "What kind of angel are you? We're the friggin' Winchesters." Good point, Sam. Also, how amusing was it that he pulled a "don't you know who we are" thing?
- Holy shit, Cass, that was so badass. Digging a bullet out of his own body? And then shoving it into the other angel's eye??? BAMF!
- Kevin, ILU. He must have been in Advanced Placement Drama Club, too.
- I find it adorable that Metatron isn't an archangel in this universe. He was a secretary.
- God made plans for when he left, so I'm thinking he's not gonna show up again. He's watching from afar like this is some sort of science experiment.
- Kevin, I like it when you get saucy with Crowley.
- YES!!!!!!!!!!! Metatron, YESSSSS! That was a hell of a way to save Kevin.
- Wow, that is some heavy shit, Metatron. "Ask yourself what is it going to take to do this and what will the world be like when it's done."
- Kevin got the second half of the tablet. Kevin, you magnificent bastard.
- "To cure a demon." Third trial. Cure a demon. Yeah, what DOES that mean?
- "Well, we're headed somewhere. The end." Ominous, Sam. And reminiscent of a certain Lucifer line "We will always end up here." This time it's an ending of their own choosing, though.
- Do you think Cass tried to land in the Impala but missed because he's so hurt?
Comments
His dialogue, his creativity, his vision, his pacing, his depth - someone give this man an award, please!
That scene where Sam talks about having never felt clean, always knowing, even before the demon blood, that he could never be the "Sir Galahad" of the story - beautiful. Brought me to tears. Jared deserves an Emmy for that one. It's such an insight into his character. Yes, he jumped in the pit, but that was about penance and redemption. This is different. This is Sam's opportunity to be the white knight - and that's why it's so important to him. Because for him, it makes up for a lifetime of feeling impure, of never feeling good enough. And it's something he never would have admitted to Dean had he not been so worn down and ill.
And Dean's quiet, "It's not your fault."
I'm surprised that some interpreted this scene as meaning Sam is being purged of the demon blood. I don't think that's what it meant all. Sam was speaking metaphorically. He was speaking from the heart. It reminded me of way back in S2, 'Houses of the Holy' - that Sam who prays, who seeks to be righteous, is still in there. He's just been buried under years of torment, poor choices, and bad luck. I love that we got to see that side of him again.
Other things:
Dean's "we should've brought him here" made me want to throw something at my screen. Duh!
Also - Kevin's video scene was emotionally gut-wrenching as well. And I loved Dean's reaction. But I was a little confused by Kevin's seeming 180 in this ep from terrified prophet to prophet with a backbone. I guess one can only be terrified for so long.
No, fake Sam and Dean were not Leviathans. I had thought they were angels, since angels are working with Crowley now, and the place wasn't warded against them. But I believe at the end Crowley said they were demons. A slip up? Doesn't happen with Ben Edlund - I probably missed something.
Loved the angel scenes. Naomi was frightening and dangerous. Cas was amazing - "we're supposed to be their shepherds, not their murderers." He's always been a true guardian at heart.
Loved the rogue angel, the one working for Crowley. "Nothing matters" - the despair and confusion that have plagued the angels since the apocalypse was set in motion was well-captured.
Loved Metatron. I can already tell he's going to be a great character. "It's all about the story." It is indeed - which is why I watch this show! I'm glad he saved Kevin. Very interesting that, being the scribe of heaven, he can erase angel sigils.
And Crowley - more clever and ruthless than ever! "I was born to direct." I love how he thought to melt the angel blade down into bullets - next weapon for Sam and Dean?
Finally, we get an indication that there may be consequences to closing the gates. Can't wait to find out what those are.
And curing a demon? That's pretty significant. I wonder what the implications of that will be.
Okay - now I've written too much. I give this one an A+
Can't wait for the next one!
Speaking of continuity
Quote:That's what I remember from Hunted. Dean wanting to go to the Grand Canyon because they had never been. Then in the Ghostfacers episode, it got referenced again when Sam said to Dean
Quote:Which makes it sound as if they never did make it to the Grand Canyon. The really odd part is that Ben Edlund wrote Ghostfacers. I understand not watching every episode of the series. I am less understanding that someone isn't checking Super Wiki to avoid these continuity errors. I even understand that after this many episodes Jared and Jensen may have forgotten that they hadn't been to the Grand Canyon, but couldn't Ben Edlund remember what he wrote and that it was important enough that Sam gave Dean his Grand Canyon in season three?
You know, when I was a real little kid, my parents took me to the beach. The only way I ever knew I had been there when I was older was pictures.
It wasn't a memory for me, so in my mind, I had never been there. Even though in actuality, I had.
So I always said to people, "I've never been to the beach."
Now Sam said he was remembering things from his past with great clarity. Things he hadn't remembered before - things he shouldn't remember because he was too young. Dean hadn't even remembered the Grand Canyon trip. So perhaps it wasn't too big of a slip. (Even as I write this though, I know it's not gonna be good enough).
I just hate to think of Edlund making a slip up like that. But hey, they're only human. And the episode kicked butt regardless, IMO.
Personally, I went to Niagara Falls when I was 8 and did not remember it at all. When I went back later in life, my Mom had to remind me that I had been there before.
But I think the all the weird stuff on the boat could be explained by him working with an angel. Angel have been shown manipulating perceptions, erasing memories, etc, before this so I this a reasonable case can be made for the angel setting up a lot of that for Crowley.
Le sigh.
On second watch, I realized that there was no continuity errors in the fake Sam and Dean scene.
Crowley had taken Kevin, wiped his memory, and put him on a supernatural stage, with a fake, but realistic boat, fake holy water, fake Sam and Dean, fake everything - so that he could get information faster.
Man, I'm slow on the uptake this week!
Really excellent review. My thoughts on the perfect episode.
Can we have an “AMEN†for the return of Robert Duncan McNeill? AMEN! I hope it is not 8 years before he returns. Tons of beautiful shots, interesting camera work showing Sam’s struggle, just all around awesomeness to a Season that has had lots of new and “old†directors knocking it out of the part on a weekly basis.
I was in awe of Jared Padalecki. My all time favorite Jared performance was in “The End†when he played Lucifer. I remember at the time thinking that was going to be great or bad, and it was phenomenal. But last night my favorite Jared performance changed to “The Great Escapist.†The much mentioned Knights of the Round Table scene was his standout in the Series, IMHO. Thank you Jared.
Metatron’s home, the maze of books everywhere, WOW! So cool!
I agree maybe Kevin should have been with the boys at the MOL, but Kevin was protected (they thought), Garth was there. It’s hindsight, and you could say the boys should know if you want something done right…
Naomi is turning out to be a classic Supernatural character. I love seeing her mad and badass. Amanda Tapping, thank you.
Cas and Crowley, as fantastic as ever, thank you.
Metatron, perfect introduction.
BEN EDLUND, all greatness starts with him. Can we have 100 “AMENS†for Ben? I literally was on the edge of my couch the entire 42 minutes.
My QUESTIONS are, what was up with the Kevin/Crowley kidnap we thought we saw in “Taxi Driver?†What am I missing?
How did Kevin know Crowley cannot hurt Kevin, or make him spill the Tablet deets? Was that something Kevin just discovered in the Tablet?
A+ episode. What a great day to be a Supernatural fan.
Oh, and I wholeheartedly agree with Bamboo24. An A+.
I just didn't think that was what he was saying at all.
You want to talk about retcon - if Sam is being cleansed of the demon blood now, that's a HUGE retcon. It was already cleaned out of his system, for starters. And there's been no issues or mention of it since he got out of the Cage. It's way out of left field for them to revisit that storyline, IMO.
I agree with your beach example. Regardless that is such a minor thing, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. Although it is a little surprising because he usually is fabulous with continuity.
Regarding the Grand Canyon bit - it is bothersome to me, but I'm not gonna hold onto it. Ben Edlund gave us a wonderful episode, and I've loved this entire season.
If I'm thinking of the same episode as you, Sam bit himself to get his blood to paint a demons trap on the ceiling of his cell. Not to get the demon blood. (And how would drinking his own demon blood give him more demon blood to "fuel his powers"? I don't understand that)
You are correct. I remembered something about demons and Sam drinking his blood, but not the connection. I don't fact check myself before 8AM, too busy getting coffee :)
Yeah, I'm not sure about the Grand Canyon thing, other than Dean probably didn't remember it until Sam said something.
I think it was never brought up because it hadn't really been relevant to the story line in S6/S7. It is, however, very relevant to Sam's quest for "normal" in S8. Have also seen comments about how Sam knows he's being cleansed; well, he'd really be the only one in a position to know because the changes are happening to him.
I am one who believes Sam statement is literal. He has a link to Metatron that is bringing his memories into sharp focus, no reason to believe it isn't doing other things as well, such as giving Sam this insight. I quite frankly think it is wonderful. He was feeling good about it and actually feeling happy about it. Not only will the trials shut the gates of hell, they will free him of the pain and scars he has carried his entire life because of it. That is IF he completes the third trial. Either way, I hope the cleansing he has felt so far is permanent.
I am not answering you specifically njspnfan, it's just where I was when I decided to address it. There are probably 40 more comments after this and demon blood is no longer the topic.
My only issue I guess, if Sam really is coughing up demon blood, is the fact that because it's part of his blood as a whole, he'd have to essentially purge himself of all of it in order to get clean. And then he'd be dead. It's not like the demon blood within him is separate from his real blood. So what, is he going to cough up all the blood in his body? Doesn't seem realistic to me.
The other thing that has always bugged me is this - baby-Sam ingested the demon blood, and just a few drops at that. If you ingest blood, it's digested, it doesn't get in your veins and become a part of you. So...I guess demon blood doesn't follow the rules of biology? lol
Sam has been all over the place with the demon blood. He was cleared of it in Sympathy for the Devil. He drank it again in the Famine episode then detoxed. He really drank it in Swan Song. We never heard if he came back cleansed of it after the Cage, although I think he was.
I think the trials would have purified anyone who undertook them. No human is completely pure. I also dislike the idea that Sam was tainted for the entire series and that we should look back and see him as unclean for all these years. I don't know what Carver is aiming for. I hope it comes together for me in the final episodes of the season.
I think you called it on the PIP in next weeks episode!
Also, guess Meg is out of the running to be cured because she got killed with an angel knife-but it would be cute to have her healed and she gets with Cass.
But if she is out of the picture, is it possible that Crowley would be the choice and the cure wouldn't work on him because he is not a demon or even a fallen angel. What if he was God, say on walkabout.
Just throwing it out there.
Why am I not surprised the phrase ‘farting donkey’ showed up in Edlund episode?
And BE’s ode to writers via Metatron – how meta is that?
I thought the scene in which the boys played Kevin’s ‘last message’ was really emotionally powerful – wonderfully written, beautifully acted by all three. The gamut of emotions Kevin/Osric Chau ran through really packed a punch. Amazing work, too, from JP as Sam finds clarity through delirium and JA as worry for Sam and guilt over Kevin’s ‘death’ put Dean through the wringer.
And everyone had their clever clogs on tonight – and happily I’m not being facetious. How awesome was it that plot progression was made through good guys – and bad – outSMARTing their opponents, rather than one playing dimwit du jour. Thank you again, Mr. Edlund.
After eight years, J & J know their characters so well; As tonight’s demonSam/demonD ean, I love that they play it straight but change up just a little thing here and there so that something’s just ever so slightly ‘off,’ triggering that little voice in the back of the viewer’s head that says, “Wait a minute…â€
I’m a happy SPN fan tonight.
I love Ben Edlund so much. So very very much. How much did he cram in that episode without it feeling rushed? I really really love him.
And I love the way he writes Sam. Dean too obviously. But I swear sometimes I think he's the only who really gets Sam. And he actually wrote in an episode the difference in the characters. Which is freaking hilarious. But I swear he was almost mocking the other writers with this, because half the time this is ALL they do with Sam. Basic and sincere. But Edlund has him talking about farting mules, (I think you're right about Dean saying they'd never been to the Grand Canyon), Scooby Doo villians, and breaking my heart with believing he has never been "clean", even as a child. Plus he gave us wet Sam. I like wet Sam.
Plus did you notice how he explains his inconsistencies (well except the Grand Canyon thing-although Dean did say he barely remembered it, so perhaps he forgot before), but I kept asking why Crowley could do all these "angel" things but then he has there be a rogue angel. Which also explains why Crowley was able to get to Kevin with the boat being warded against demons. Brilliant.
About them curing a demon, I think your thoughts with Crowley are great but I can't see them making Crowley a good guy. Maybe they'll have him be a guy but still evil and working against them. But I don't know.If Meg was still alive I would guess in might be her. I absolutely adore the idea of it being Adam. I want him out of the cage and in Heaven too. And if he became a demon that would be a good reason he was out of the cage. But I doubt that's going to happen too.
I could do a several page review on everything fabulous in this episode but you mentioned most of them
I actually wondered about this new trial in relation to Dean...if they find out how to restore a demon's humanity, is it possible that they could restore the part of Dean that was left back in the Pit?
I think saving a "part of Dean" is a little to philosophical for a trial. Both the other trials have been pretty concrete. But do I wonder how this is going to relate to the Sacrifice, since that is what the last episode is called. What is going to have to be sacrificed so they can cure a demon? Or perhaps Sacrifice is referring to them finding out some reason to not close the gates of hell and the consequences to Sam because of that decision.
This was a really great episode. Why? (Beside the fact that it was Edlund and awesome for all the reasons everyone else has mentioned..) Because we finally saw a Sam that I recognized. A Sam with thoughts and feelings and WORDS. OMG! (Were you watching writers?? It IS possible to write for Sam!!! Now don't forget it!!!)
I enjoyed this episode for bringing together so many plot lines, calling back to the past, and for tying everything together in a way that worked!
And having Dean address one of the major wtf moments of the season - why didn't they just take Kevin into the bunker? - THANK YOU Edlund! At least Dean knows they really messed up that one.
I'm not sure how I feel about the purification of Sam. I'd like to know how Sam knows what is happening. Is it his hope? Is it really cleansing him? Or is it more like a ritualistic cleansing as if he was doing a quest of old? If Sam is truly "becoming human", will the writers have any better idea how to write for him?
The demon to be "cured".... somehow I doubt it will be Crowley. Much easier to grab stunt demon #3, but I'm guessing they're going after Abbadon. She's missing her head, but they made a point of saying they couldn't actually kill her - Why else make the point if it isn't going to come back into play later on?
As far as the Grand Canyon thing. I believe it was a mistake on Edlunds part. They'd never been. But I have so many other issues with the rewritting of canon going on this season, that that one is a pretty minor blip. And the farting donkey bit was funny. Edlund gets the pass from me.
I'll even give this episode an A. First one for the season.
Quote:Geez, I'm such a dumb-dumb, I hadn't even thought of that!
robbie thompson too! ; )
i am thrilled when sam's character is portrayed as multi-dimenstio nal and with great sensitivity (and when we get some sam pov!!). it is what hooked me on supernatural way back when ... hooray for the talents of ben eland (and robbie thompson).
cheers!
ps. i'm am a through and through jared padalecki/sam fan, but dean and ackles are FABULOUS too -- how much depth and maturity is he bringing to his performances this year. right? ja has always been brilliant, but there is something even deeper and more powerful and beautifully subtle about his portrayal.
Cannot wait for next week. I cannot believe how great this show is as it heads into the end of season 8! Thanks fot the well written and quick review!
Great episode I kept getting angry with the commercial breaks.
Sam was a little out of his head and with a hugely high temp needing an ice bath ( shallow end was he neckid!) maybe he was just rambling about the Grand Canyon and being a little delirious.
Anywhoo can't wait for the next installment of the adventures of Sam and Dean
Is it possible that Sam could be the "demon" that needs to be cured due to the demon blood? Part of the cure would involve the flashbacks and then maybe the sacrifice would be the opportunity to live a life without the demon blood in him - which would be completely different from the life he's lived. Or, something along those lines.
See, this is why I try to stay away from speculation. My mind wanders to crazy territory.
I thought exactly the same thing. The whole way through the episode I was shouting out IT'S SAAAAAM!!! So glad you thought it too.
Didn't you think that the rogue angel looked like Jake Gyllenhaal? I was hoping that he would end up helping Cas. I hate it when Crowley gets to the angels.
Also, was it just me who thought that Cas didn't seem too worried about Crowley and the angel tablet. Perhaps he has hidden it somewhere and tricked Crowley into thinking he has the real one!!
About the tablet, perhaps its just that the tab is useless without Kevin.
I hope you are right about the tablet and that Kevin is the only one who can interpret. But I have learnt never to underestimate that evil son-of-a-gun Crowley (may he rot in hell) and I bet he has already deciphered the other half and already knows what demon is going to be cured as he is ALWAYS a step ahead. (I was so happy when I saw his face on fire in the end, I was going "YESSSS burn you bugger burn")
I've been thinking the exact same thing with Sam as the demon to cure! Perhaps curing a demon involves killing off the demon part of him-like a Harry Potter horcrux kind of thing going on. Maybe Dean has to kill Sam, all of Sam, to cure the demon part, and take it on faith alone that Sam will come back, and that's Dean's sacrifice to close the gates. Sam's is obviously allowing himself to be cured-he could just say no, stay impure (his belief), but be alive and keep things status quo, as weird as status quo is when you're a Winchester, and they keep on fighting monsters and demons and the gates of Hell stay open.
But if Sam is the demon to be cured, where does he go if he doesn't find his way back? God's gone, so Naomi's probably not letting the human part of him into heaven, and the gates of Hell would be closed, so no going there. And Purgatory's out, since it's not for humans.
Maybe if this played out, we'd see Sam in an entirely different world we haven't seen yet in Season 9 and Dean and Cas working to find him and restore him.
Or if none of this came to be, at least the boys might know how to cure demons now, and be able to help some like Meg in season 9.
And I too am mildly ashamed to admit my shallow end attraction for Sick!Sam - it was like Michael on one shoulder after Sam collapsed saying "Should you help him?" and Lucifer on the other saying "Should you take advantage of this situation?" :)
Quote:That sounds so typical Supernatural S1-5. I can just see it happening, and then we will have to wait an entire year to have it resolved. I swear I am experiencing incremental death by Supernatural with these hiatuses and season finale dramas. Honestly!!!
That would be a great turn of events indeed! I never thought of that. When they found out what the third trial was, I was like, how the hell are they going to cure a demon?
I TOO, HAVE NEVER LIKED THE FACT THAT THEY JUST LEFT ADAM DOWN THERE. KINDA COLD. THEY HAVE DONE MUCH MORE WITH FAR LESS & THIS IS THEIR HALF BROTHER. [IN 1 OF THE ROLE PLAYING TWEET STORIES, LUCIFER AND MICHAEL ARE TOYING AND SEXUALLY HURTING ADAM. NEVER UNDERSTOOD THAT EITHER.]
I GUESS KEVIN PARKS WAS NOT AROUND TO TELL THEM ABOUT DEAN SAYING THEY HAD NEVER BEEN TO THE GRAND CANYON. 1ST HISTORY OF THE BOYS SLIP-UP I CAN THINK OF.
ITS 0350HRS HERE & I HAVE 3 DOCTORS TO GO TO TODAY SO I HAVE NOT READ THE OTHER COMMENTS YET. HOPE I DID NOT REPEAT ANYTHING. BBL THANKS ARDE
I need to make a list of all the things Edlund did in that script last night to placate fan complaints. It's wonderful he put that much care into this script. He loves us!
I was literally screaming at the screen every time they mentioned Kevin, "Bring him to the batcave!" But at least they address it.
i was confused at the very beginning. kevin was in the boat...i thought he took off...did he decide to go back? at first i thought the whole scene with kevin wasn't even real.
you know, crowley has his hands in everything. now we're seeing demons with the ability to morph....you know i still don't think it's out of the realm of possibility that crowley is somehow involved in sam's year off... especially when crowley made the comment about him directing...as if he's been in charge the whole time ....you know what i mean...it's almost as if his role has been director this entire time, with sam and dean part of his cast, but them not knowing it. it's still that paranoia in me rearing it's ugly head..
i do agree that sam's changes are because all that God light transferred into him with ea. trial is scrubbing away the demon blood....a lot of us called that one....good on us.
i don't think sam is the demon though...in all honesty, i've always though sam the most human character despite the db.
metatron kind of hinted that closing the gates may not be such a good idea. i mean, where does that leave earth if demons can't get into hell? i don't think sam and dean are seeing the big picture yet...
i still think the sacrifice is not closing the gates.
what i wonder though is if they don't close the gates, will sam stay sick? he's done two out of three trials so my guess he's got most of the db out of him....if he doesn't do the last trial, would he still feel unclean? it could be seen as sam's sacrifice to give up total purification... and seemingly in his mind, never really being a normal human...
just my take on it...
did enjoy the eppy....the boys rocked it.....and wet sam...yummy...
i still can't believe booger is metatron though....
Things that confused me: Has Crowley been watching Kevin via closed circuit TV this whole time? If so, how come he didn't just grab Kevin earlier when he still had the tablet or why doesn't he know where Kevin hid his half of the tablet and just went and got it? If so, why wasn't he more aware of what Sam and Dean have been up to for weeks now, seeing as how they talked about a lot of relevant things while they were on the boat. And where was Crowley watching Kevin from exactly? Is there a direct portal into hell from earth now? or was that some kind of surveillance area? And I thought Kevin had fled the boat at the end of Taxi Driver, but now he's back there, but Sam and Dean still don't know where he is and have been looking for him for weeks? I thought the boat was warded against demons, but fake demon Sam and Dean can suddenly get on board? and later Crowley can too? So, now I am back to asking if Crowley could/can get on board that boat why didn't he do it sooner when Kevin still had the tablet? Did I miss something that helps tie all that together? I guess I'll have to watch it again.
Next...CASTIEL! ! Oh seeing him sitting there going from restaurant to restaurant to fool the other angels...he looked so lost! I wanted to throw something at my tv when Crowley was digging into him trying to get the tablet out. And taking out his own bullet and killing the other angel with it? Oh yes, my Cas is one BAMF!!
And...I knew he could hear Metatron...I knew that what was going on as soon as it started. Oh it just about broke my heart to hear him tell Dean he remembered thinking he was unlclean...Poor Sammy!! As for the purification..I think it may be the demon blood but more than that also...He's becoming very angel like..Maybe his soul will be purified or some how will be filled with Grace. Wouldn't it just be heartbreaking to know this is cleansing him, making him pure, then have the sacrifice be the fact he has to give that back up?? We know all he ever wanted was to be normal, to not feel like a freak. What if he gets his wish, but has to give it up to slam the Gates?? It makes me wonder what will happen now that they have to consider maybe closing the Gates isn't the best idea...but I love that Metatron told them...It their choice...It's always been about choice and free will...the Winchesters prevail everytime!
I am not thrilled that Sam and Dean didn't realize that Crowley had Kevin all along, but hey, they are human and make mistakes, and I didn't realize it either!
It's all quite brilliant actually. I watched this episode 3 times last night. Everything lined up. Except the Grand Canyon, but I'm in a super forgiving mood.
I particularly liked Crowley's comments to his fake Sam and Dean that he wanted them to have "two distinct personalities" and to not make Sam too slangy and familiar because he was the more "basic and sincere of the two." Could that have been a little dig at previous attempts to write Sam?
I am looking forward to (can't wait, really [insert evil grin here]) a week of speculation/arg uing about 1) the Grand Canyon, 2) why did Sam think he was unpure so early in life 3) does he really have demon blood now, 4) which demon are they going to save, and 5) why have they been so careless with Kevin so far.
I love Ben Edlund. So he forgot - or did he? - one detail that happened in season 3. He wrote a great script.
Metatron was cool. The actor had to live through the 70's, 80's and 90's just like the rest of us. Didn't he ge to be on "moonlighting" too? But he has this gig now. He was cool.
Sick!Tired!Sam is so hot I can hardly stand it.
Loved it. A ++++. 15 out of 10. 7 gold stars out of 4.
I don't care about any quibbles I had. Yes I had some quibbles and I Just DON'T CARE!
Nice synergy with Metatron and the Native American tradition of storytelling.
Wow - really got a raw look at what's going on with Sam. His fever dreams are causing vivid memories and moments of clarity. He normally keeps his emotions in check but they are exploding to the surface now. This isn't about how Dean or others view Sam, it's about how Sam views himself. He still thinks of himself as unclean/unworth y because of the demon blood. This closing the gates is not just driven by revenge for him; got to see how personal and emotional this is to him. It will be interesting to see how this plays out - will Sam be willing to do anything to "purify" himself, even die, or will outside circumstances force him to NOT complete the third trial, sacrificing his effort to close the gates and purify/cleanse himself once and for all?
The writing, directing and acting was top notch this week; everyone really brought their A game, especially Osric and Jared. Was a little worried about Curtis Armstrong playing Metatron but, after watching it a second time, I can't see anyone else in that role now. Had a minor quibble with the choppiness of moving between story lines at times but am overlooking that. Is next Wednesday here yet?
Sam revealing that he felt unclean even as a tiny boy broke my heart. My poor, poor boy. Jared does the teary eyes so incredibly well. He was fantastic in this scene and throughout the entire episode. Plus, Sick!Sam really is so very, very hot. Which sounds so wrong but I just can't help it...
Loved the Sam insight that came with Sam's fever. It was wonderful to see his emotions and hear his thoughts. THANK YOU Mr. Edlund!! Poor Sam. He still sees himself as unclean, still thinks he has evil inside him. Yup, Sam ripped my heart to shreds in this episode. I kept thinking back to HOTH and his heartbreaking wish that somehow he might be saved. I can't wait to see what is ahead for Sam in the last two episodes although I'm kind of terrified for him too. He finally has a chance to be rid of the demon blood, to no longer be the 'freak' he sees himself as, to be normal. To be finally saved. What if this all goes wrong??
Loved how caring Dean was: making Sam soup; holding on to Sam and guiding him around the stacks of books in Metatron's room; wrapping the towel around Sam. Awww...just loved it. When Sam talked about how Dean used to read to him when he was tiny I just about melted. Oh Dean! Bless you. Plus you know he must have done the aeroplane thing when Sam was tiny and Dean was trying to feed his little brother.
I think Edlund writes both brothers so very well. I am so pleased with how he wrote Sam in this episode. Edlund truly gets Sam.
The Grand Canyon thing had me going a bit squinty and WTH but that didn't spoil anything for me. I thought it was a fabulous episode.
I'm glad i was wrong. Adm Edlund i think is the ONLY writer who gets Sam and writes him as a fully realized, layered person. And it was in full force here. We got too see part of that human story Carver claims Sam has. We got to see it from Sam and not just through subtext wrapped in an enigma. And it was beautiful. The memory of the farty donkey made Sam practicalllu collapse into giggles and then later learning Deann read to Sam and how the story of Galahad affected him at such a young age.
Castiel....I kept feeling really bad for poor Jimmy still stuck in his own body. I really wanted Cas to talk to Ion and get him to switch sides. It really seemed the guy coukld be talked into it. So i was upset that Cas killed him. But...honestly? Was there really time? Cas did what he had to do. Besides ION probably burned that poor waitress' eyes out. So...an eye for an eye. He!!!
Dean and The Grand Canyon. Honestly. If the boys have time for baseball games, rock concerts, and annual vegas trips you have to wonder why Dean just doesn't GO if he wants. I think maybe Dean has idealized The Gran Cany0on to epic porportions. Maybe Mary had told him they would go when Sam go old enough. She died and a few years later John fuullfiilled this family wish. While Mary was missing Dean had his family together, doing something normal and fun for a change. MAybe JOhn wasn't drinking at the time. So this ...even if Dean doesn't remember it ...The Gran Canyon becomes an IDEAL for Dean. and to revisit the grand canyon as an adult cann never live up to that ideal. It will simply never live up to his expectations. So he talks about it but never puts any effort into going.
Metranon was kind of cool. Kevin was awesome. Naomi and the Angels are boring, rotten one note prats as Crowly would say.
I think God left because he gave all of us free will. Ans he is allowing all of his creations to make their own choices as Metranon said. God, I think must be crying because of how his beloved Angels are utilizing Free Will. While Demons are evil; Angels are evil by choice.
Oh, Sam! Jared Padalecki sure acted the bejesus outta that! HELLO EMMY, ANYONE LISTENING???? It made me so freaking sad when he talked about Galahad and his purity and that, even as a little boy, he knew something wasn't right with him, that he could never go on such a quest.
I had the fake Sam & Dean pegged from the beginning. There is no way they would be that amiable to Kevin!
Okay, on to the speculation portion of our program. What, pray tell, do they have to do to cure a demon?
Anyway, I need to rewatch a whole bunch of times, and oh no, only 2 episodes left!
Jake Gyllenangel- Funny!
just rewatched...i did laugh out loud yet again when sam told dean he couldn't really say indians...
i also didn't notice this yesterday, but when the boys were checking into the hotel and sam asked if they heard that....dean's face, he told the clerk sam had the flu and then he did this crazy headshake thing pointing to sam...didn't notice that until now...made me giggle.
did also love sam giving metatron the whole...don't you know who we are spiel...that was actually quite funny.
do you think naomi is an angel? just the way she spoke to cas....calling him angel, as if he were something different than she was...
do love sam opening up..hoping that's not all he'll be opening up about...wink wink...sure would like to get his pov about the first half of the season...could we be getting that sometime very soon you think?
i do like metatron and i think he and cas will make for quite a pairing...
but as much as he's booger to me....i'll always be greatful to him for giving us one of the most important quotes to ever be uttered in a movie...
i don't remember his character's name...but i believe he said this in risky business....and it still holds true today...
"sometimes you just gotta say...what the f***.....:D
oh and the whole gotta cure a demon...well looked up cure on the dictionary....h ere's what i got
a : to restore to health, soundness, or normality b : to bring about recovery from
2a : to deal with in a way that eliminates or rectifies b : to free from something objectionable or harmful
3: to prepare or alter especially by chemical or physical processing for keeping or use
sam's not a demon so i don't know if he qualifies..but he thinks he's not normal due to demon blood, so if you look at it that way, maybe sam does qualify?
really am curious about this one.
Cure a demon? How you do that? Maybe Dean can whip something up in the well stocked MOL kitchen
Sticking with my theory that Naomi is a higher order being in the angel hierarchy. Her tone was similar to how Cas referred to Cupid in Bloody Valentine, a lower order being.
And you're right, we're not done hearing from Sam; me thinks the floodgates have opened up on that one, at least for the remainder of the season.
So, imagine that Sam and Dean have actually been to the Grand Canyon. Who knows what gets erased when a mind is scraped? What might Sam "remember" from that episode? Especially if he feels he is being purified? Could what he shared with Dean (He laughed like that when he was drunk in "Playthings". Is his laughter from delirium or are we seeing into a child-like Sam who of course would have laughed at a farting donkey) have been an example of normalcy that John was actually able to provide for his sons?
There are very few accidents that can be attributed to Ben Edlund's writing, either in his depiction of either Sam or Dean's characters or the events and the importance of those events. Sam is seeing things more clearly...thing s that may have been suppressed or scraped. Who would have done that to a child? Hmm. Isn't it beautiful that even as children, Dean read Illustrated Comics of The Adventures of King Arthur and the Knights of the Round Table to Sam. Even then, Dean sought out heroic and possibly mythical figures to emulate and Sam, tragically, felt he could never become Sir Galahad because something was "wrong" inside of him.
Always I ramble...but I thought there were quite a lot of examples of peoples' minds being scraped and how our perceptions of our stories might affect who we see ourselves, others and the choices we make. Metratron's character certainly presented those dilemmas. Which story do we believe? What do we do? And can we live with the decisions?
I laughed when Crowley's lackeys told him he would have made a great Dean. I wonder why Crowley chose young men to imitate them. It is probably no accident that it is harder for the one acting as Sam to carry it off. Crowley ought to know that "moose" is the observant one...Ha.
I really doubt they end the last trial. Too much collateral damage, I think. Then my question will be... how Sam will return to normal?
The guys should give Metraton Chuck's books, so he can get up to date on the Winchesters new "new" testament.
By the way, Osric Chau's acting was superb last night too!
Trial #1 - Sam kills a hell hound and saved Dean; he wasn't able to do that at the end of S3.
Trial #2 - Sam retrieves Bobby's soul trapped in hell; the man that was like a father to them. Sam wasn't able to do that after S3 to save Dean from hell
Trial #3 - Cure a demon; wonder if this all ties in to, or comes full circle on redeeming himself to Dean (at least in Sam's eyes).
I have to admit, I am absolutely obsessed with seasons 1 trough 5. The storylines are awe-inspiring and the characters are developed and relationships between them are amazingly intricate. (Side note: personal favorites S2E1 and S5E22). Even though the writers had progressively moved away from the more scary lore inspired monsters of the earlier seasons, they had compensated with action packed sequences sprinkled with the perfect amount of character development and growth.
However since the perfect ending of season 5, I have found myself a bit angry that they pursued the series. Season 6 was mediocre at best – and frustrating with psycho killer Sam. Season 7 was fun but predictable – not to mention killing off Bobby and making him stick around as a ghost for a while... I had tuned in again this year with a shameful sense of dread that my favorite series was progressively going belly-up with only the amazing acting of Jared and Jensen keeping it alive. Although season 8 was progressively going nowhere with the boys perpetually stuck in the ‘losing – finding and losing again’ of their prophet and/or tablet, I stuck it out and this episode was worth it!
It’s like a breath of fresh air to finally have some three dimension put back into the characters and their storyline. I am quite happy with this one (Grand Canyon fluke put aside) and I hope this means the beginning of a new story arc that goes somewhere and that isn’t so predictable!
My feeling is Season 8 is light years better than Season 6 and 7, and it started with episode 1 in Season 8. It did not just find its way back with this episode IMO, rather all Season 8. There are some mis-steps here and there, but there were some in Seasons 1-5. Seasons 6&7 did have GREAT moments, episodes, and string-of-episo des, but for me Season 8 started off already with a huge improvement in character ,writing, interesting stories. We've gotten excellent new characters (Benny, Naomi) rather than faux pas deaths (Bobby, R.I.P.) and total misfires ("the Mother"). To be at this point in the Season, with where the boys are now compared to where they started, PLUS the game changing Men of Letters and the new Lair, Season 8 has for me been very very strong, all Season long.
totally agree with you here. It has been a good solid season with a few glitches here and there (cough Amelia cough, and the Doberman with the sparkly collar.. ouch episode.)
My only regret will be the PTB not explaining Sam's uncharacteristi c behaviour in not looking for Dean.
I have been reading some comments on other sites who say this season's stories have less 'monster' in them and are therefore less fearful, but I think that the mytharc's, characters and plots have become far more sophisticated and mature of late. There is so much possibility for the story to expand into almost any direction, which is a feat of note in itself 9 years later.
I was wondering what demon could be cured? and if they can cure one demon, then why not them all? Imagine if they cured YED, doesn't he know a lot about the gates of hell?
Do you know what to cure a demon means? It can't be exorcism, anyone who the right Latin words can do that. I am confused by the idea. Return it to it's original human form that it had in hell? I didn't think being a demon was something akin to sickness. Any ideas?
I wish I knew! There has been so much speculation. You are so right, it cannot be an exorcism. It has to be something unique that only Sam can do. Along those lines, I was also thinking that if there are third trial 'instructions' to cure one demon, then surely they can use it to cure all demons?
You are right it is confusing because if you look at how demons have been portrayed, then there are many options to consider. Ruby said that demons were all human once who went dark side because of so many years in hell. Curing one of these would restore them back to human setting, but does this mean you need to give them 'medicine' (to cure the sickness) in the form of, say a soul (Sam's eeeek) for example. I really don't know, but what I do know it requires a sacrifice of some kind on Sam's part.
We have seen demons possess humans in the form of black smoke, which is confusing because that means demons can exist as black smoke. So how do you 'cure' black smoke? Also, all demons are not equal. There are demons that are impervious to Ruby's knife. There are also the 'original' demons such as Eve, who are very powerful. I lose count of how many types of demons there are.
I am sure though that whoever Sam cures has got to be very significant to the plot because it is scribed onto the demon tablet to close the gates of hell. My bet is it is the YED who knows a lot about closing and opening the gates of hell. It would also be lovely plot symmetry to end where it begins. Anyway this is far more than you needed to hear so sorry about the verbosity. What are your thoughts on this?
It could very well be Adam. k He has been down there the longest and Ruby said eventually everybody turns, so maybe Adam is a demon by now. Also it would be fitting to have closure on Adam 3 seasons later. Also I think it would be someone Sam is willing to sacrifice himself for. My bet is he goes into hell with Dean, rescues Adam and they end the season with them BOTH stuck in the pit. Now that hasn't been done before.
The demon tablet contains instructions for closing the gates of hell.
The leviathan tablet contained instructions for killing the alpha/lead Leviathan.
Been going along with the assumption that the angel tablet is for closing the gates of heaven or eliminating angels from earth. An emphasis has been placed on many angels being programmed/memo ry wiped/manipulat ed by a few angels. What if the angel tablet contains instructions for resetting ALL angels to their factory default setting, which is to serve man? It would be understandable why Naomi would have her knickers all in a twist over that.
Does "Cure a Demon" = "Exorcism" ?
This is a good storytelling. The episode is complex and jumping around places many times but still able to keep the pace and still interesting. Not boring at all.
It has all the feels and ... I just love how the storyline flows this episode. No cringe worthy part and there is no breach of continuity.
About The Grand Canyon thing. It seems Dean forget many things that happen when he was little.
Great episode!!! Bravo for the writer!!
I wonder how you cure a demon...To make a demon you torture it...so what do you do to cure it....make it happy? lol They gonna go around and try to make all the demon's wishes come true til they are happy again? lol I don't know just wondering what the opposite or torture is. :-p
All kidding aside, maybe you have something there.
"Dr Scowly Scowl..he like a villain from Scooby Doo" i think that and "what kind of angel are you? We're the friggin Winchesters" are Sam's best lines (aside from when he was breaking my heart saying he wasn't clean).
Yay for Sam POV, long may it continue
Metatron is Kevin's angel I believe and so he should have been able to know all about him. He was just not knowing what was going on by force of will I think. I imagine that the death of a prophet and his replacement would send somewhat of a reverberation through the angel-waves so M knew that he wasn't dead.
It was mostly Sam that was doing the 'we're the Winchesters' bit - which was really funny, they are so under the radar in every other way but goddamit the ANGELS should know who we are. And in his defence he had a highish fever and a loud whistle in his head - enough to make anyone a little cranky
I loved the fact that the 'writer is god speech', which was kinda pretentious, got undercut by Sam going 'just shoot me already'. I am assuming that BE was making fun of himself there?
Not arguing with you at all, that's just how I read these bits of the episode. (I admit I was watching the episode thinking it had been written by someone other than BE and was very impressed by the quality of the writing - I was only put right on the second viewing).
I really have to reply to your 'unappreciated caretaker' remark. It's really hard to appreciate being insulted and condescended to which is exactly what Dean did with the airplane remark and trying to force a thermometer in Sams mouth...not to mention the numerous 'kids' and 'kiddos". Honestly, would Dean appreciate anyone treating him like a child? Disrespecting him? I know this is the writers issue and while I love protective BBD as much as the next person but this behavior is so over the top its rediculous and it gets more extreme9and scarily obsessive) each year.
HAlf the time I suspect Dean needs (and prefers) Sam to be a broken baby bird (or a DIY project) so he could be super Big Brother, fly in and fix sam which feeds his se;lf esteem issues of feeling needed. Until he's faced with the possibility of Sam dying.
Sam appreciates Dean, he does. But Sam also deserves dignity and respect.
Quote:Yes. This. Dean pretty much broke my heart in this scene because, probably like many folk here, I could completely identify with what he was going through. The fear and frustration in such a situation is all consuming.
I'm sorry i didn't mean too sound like i was piling on Dean. I'm not. I do love Dean adn I love that he cares...that both boys love and care for the other. PERSONALLLY I just didn't like how Dean tried to employ the airplane method and the thermometer. It was cutting Sam out of his own health decsions. and if Sam had tried to employ those methods on Dean Sam would be laid out on the floor.
THing is Sams illness is NOT viral. Its a consequence of the trials...someth ing supernatural. So the WRITERS having Dean want sam to just wait around to get better and eat soup feels silly. Dean is the consumate hunter and a brilliant strategist. The WRITERS should have had Dean come with the idea independantly of Sam that to cure Sam of his 'sickness' is to get the trials done.
I dont blame Dean for caring about Sam and wanting to protect him I blame the writers in how they are writing Dean (and Sam). If the fans can figure out or at least hypothesise that Sams illness will vanish once the trials are done then Dean (who is a brilliant out of the box thinker) should consider it as well. Why couldn't the scene have been Dean and Sam doing research together, evidence of lunch next to them. Deans foood is gone, Sam hasn't touched his annd Dean prods a little, suggesting Sam take his tempurture as he looks worse and tells Sam he's worried that the only way Sam will get better is to finish the trials. Sam then can tell Dean how he feels like he is changing. It would be an adult converation between two brothers who are also hunters.
Its like the whoole thing with not bringing Kevin to the Bumker. Ultimately Dean and Sam didn't because the writers needed a way for Crowy to finde out about the trials and a reason too look for Metranon.
I don't know....or I do know I personally DO love Sam and Dean looking out for eachotehr showing concern for and worring about EACH OTHER.
I geus i'm in the minority becasue I actively dislike the parent/child structureal part of the relationship. it creates an imbalence between the BROTHERS. It takes away Sams automony and puts fear to much pressure on Dean.
I geuss I dont get and maybe someone can explain this to me.... The boys are supposed to be maturing; their relationship is supposed to be maturing. And yet the parent/child thing is getting more....dominan t? I'm in no way a professional but as the boys mature shouldn't the way they relate mature as well? Shouldn't the brotherly part of their relationship become more doninant and the paretn/child part become recessive? And thus then there would be more equality and a more adult relationship?
And more honest, conversations would ensue. And Sam, Dean AND the fans would know what each was thinking and know where thhe other was coming from.
On the contrary, I actually think Dean has shown incredible maturity throughout this. In prior seasons, he would have demanded that Sam stop the trials at the first sign of sickness. This season, he's supporting his brother's decisions to move forward. Dean said "I may not be able to carry the burden of these trials, but I can carry you." Of course he knows the illness is not viral - but the symptoms can still be treated. He sees his brother sick, feverish, weak, and yet determined to research and move forward on this. It's hard for Dean, but he does what he can. Tries to make sure his brother eats, sleeps, and doesn't fall over. How is that not what any normal, mature, adult sibling would do?
You mention Sam being cut out of his own health decisions - but he's not. He's refused Dean's care several times. Problem is though, Sam, who has a tendency to get obsessed just like his old man, hasn't been taking care of himself, either because he can't or because he forgets to. How can Dean be expected to just sit by and watch his brother deteriorate? He wasn't trying to 'fix' Sam with soup and a blanket, he was merely trying to keep his strength up with the only means he had.
In any case, the airplane bit was an attempt at levity - Sam hadn't eaten in three days and it was freaking Dean out. He made a joke, partly to get Sam's attention, partly to break the anxiousness he no doubt felt. The thermometer bit was also meant to be funny - and I don't see how it could be offensive. Sam had a fever. He wasn't taking care of it. It was serious enough that he was "throwing off heat waves" (and later caused him to pass out). Dean was worried, so he bought a thermometer and tried to get Sam to use it. It's nothing less than I would do for my own little sister, if she was ill and couldn't or wouldn't take care of herself.
I just don't see this as an issue of maturity at all, but rather a normal, human response to a loved one's sickness.
Exactly. Dean's Sam's brother and he loves him, he's worried about him, he wants to do anything he can to help him, that's never going to change. That's what we do for the people we love. Even when they don't want fussing over, we fuss over them because we're worried and we can't help it! Even when we know we can't help, we're still going to try.
I'm with you Leah, I think these two have made incredible headway in their relationship, especially seeing all the obstacles constantly thrown into their paths!
Quote:And I'm with you on this too...and I love this about him.
Coming from the Sam side of the relationship, I've never seen anything that makes me believe that Dean is being condescending or disrespectful to Sam(at least no more than the normal sibling bickering stuff that comes from both sides). And certainly not in this case. Quite frankly if Dean DIDN'T try to take care of Sam when he is this badly off I would have been pissed. Like last year I was frustrated by Dean's less than overwhelming concern at times. THAT is incredibly un-Dean-like. And and if being mature means going back to that, than I'll take the immaturity.
And I always seen Sam as extremely protective and likely to mother Dean too. Berating him for not resting and drinking to much and not talking about what's bothering him, etc. I'll admit that is not as prevalent this year as in the past but he has spoke of his worry and concern on several occasions.
I'm with the others if that part of the relationship disappears I would be extremely upset.
I further agree that Sam is protective of Dean but I was responding to this particular situation. S7 was my least favorite for several reasons but the foremost is that both the boys seemed depressed and numb most of the time and were not connecting at all. Sam made some efforts but to no avail. Love how much they are doing so now!
Also was just thinking why Cas didn't just hide the angel tablet under his ribcage and stay with Dean and Sam all along? Surely he would have been safer in the batcave. Also, he mentioned something about needing to hide the tablet specifically from Dean? Why would Dean be a threat to the angel tablet?
Wouldn't it be great if the Gollum had something to do with smashing Crowley's head in.
Cas and the tablet....I thought it was in his ribcage (maybe it was just his stomach and I wasn't paying that close attention) but he couldn't stay in the Batcave with them because he doesn't know about it. Dean and Sam have brought Prometheus and his family there, and they brought Charlie there. But no one else even knows it exists. Maybe Dean is a threat because if there were "trials" on the angel tablet it would be up to him to do them since Sam did the demon tablet. But I don't think Cas wants ANYONE to have the tablet. The angels want it, Crowley wants it and I'm sure we'll get to the point where the Winchesters want it. So maybe Cas thinks Dean can close the Gates of Heaven with it and that Naomi and Crowley would screw with the angels if they had it.
The Gollum smashing Crowley's head in...lmao that would be a good one! I've been wondering about Aaron and if he and the Gollum would come back into play somehow. I mean..they meet all these people when they are trying to save them...Doesn't it occur to them that some might become hunters after their own little tragedies with demons/monsters ? I think Aaron would have made a good hunter, he was funny and he was clever, he threw Dean off for a bit by pretending he was gay....lol I keep thinking Dean looked so disappointed that it wasn't a "gay thing" after all. (Not saying he wanted him to be..personally I don't see any of these "slash relationships" but I'm not hating on anyone that does.) Anyway...Aaron and the Gollum would be a sweet addition to their team. Can you imagine being a monster and having to go up against the Winchesters, Castiel, and a friggin Gollum?! Sounds like it would make a pretty sweet episode to me.
I think I'm losing my mind the closer we get to the finale but that thought made me laugh really hard.
Maybe I won't be completely wrong in the end.
If you look at the ratings the show is going from strength to strength (and just an aside, no I don't think it is because of the Arrow pairing. I honestly think the way the show has been written this season has attracted male viewership back, Sweetondean may know more about demographics, but I'm sure the increase in ratings has something to do with the direction the show has taken). Perhaps if the ratings continue to improve, then a movie might not be such an impossibility. With the J's backing off on the 'blaze of glory' end, you never know, maybe they are hoping for a movie deal. That would be such a wonderful ending to the show don't you think.
Try as I might my heart and head cannot entertain the idea of a future Supernatural without Sam and Dean though.
I was just saying to Nate that I was wondering what demon would be cured; and also if they can cure one demon, then why not them all? Imagine if they cured YED, doesn't he know a lot about the gates of hell? I know he comes from a much earlier season but then I suppose the possibility exists for any demon in series to be a candidate.
I was thinking it could also be Sam who is cured too, but I think the 'curing' process is already happening as he is being purified by the trials themselves. I also find it interesting that he is 'resonating' with Metatron as he hasn't resonated with any other angels before, even arch-angels. It's not like Metatron is a super-angel or anything, just a secretary. So either Sam is becoming an angelic being or all is not what it seems with Metatron.
As for Naomi, after the Gollum has finished Crowley bashing, I would be TOTALLY ok with him using similar violence on her. I am a total pacifist, but I have found my limit in her. I swear Naomi and Crowley are one and the same person. They are equally matched in power, cruelty and deviousness. Perhaps before heaven and hell existed all created beings had heaven and hell exist inside of them and then something happened to split them into their antithetic components, (I remember a movie like that with Demi Moore) and this is the reason for angels and demons and heaven and hell and god and the devil. You know, like a yin yang thing.
Anyways, it's Saturday afternoon, this speculating like crazy is because I have a little time on my hands!!
So I think the resonating business is due to the trials and is the trials/the Word/Metatron specific, not just angelic.
As for the ratings, well it's most likely a bunch of things.
Certainly teaming up with Arrow would have helped initially - but hey, getting the audience there is one thing, having them stick is another, and the audience has stuck this season which has been reflected in consistent ratings. So that is a reflection of general audience satisfaction if nothing else. They're still tuning in week to week.
The other thing is the move from Friday to Wednesday. We may now be seeing some numbers that were previously caught in the DVR Live+7days ratings that are now being caught in the overnight As Live ratings. Maybe more people are watching Live rather than DVRing to watch at a later date. However, the numbers have been significantly larger which would indicate a larger base audience. I'd have to look at the overall cumulative (all captured) numbers from this year to last year to understand if there's been a change. I'd also have to look at the demographic by sex breakdown to see if there's been a jump in the number of males watching the show, it's impossible to know that without having those figures.
I'll make this a mission and see if I can find more detailed ratings breakdowns for the season!
One thing to keep in mind is that we have equalled Arrow twice this season (that I recall anyway) in the targeted demographic share and we beat The Vampire Diaries last week. Pretty cool!
Another thing to keep in mind is that the CW take more than just the Nielsen's ratings into consideration. Warners have significant deals in place for cross platform screenings of Supernatural via Hulu and Netflix. These deals are worth millions to them. Plus, let's not forget DVD sales nationally and internationally , let alone the syndication deal with TNT.
In addition to that, the CW pay attention to their online viewing numbers - the official ones (
I hope that answers some questions and wasn't too boring and technical? I love me a ratings nerd out!
Thanks for the ratings info. I love to know who is watching when and how. Didn't know about netflix and the younger audience though. Interesting how technology changes how we interact!
Re the Word and Sam, I agree the resonating has got to do with the Word and Metatron. My feeling is that when he started the trials why didn't he then resonate with the tablet or Kevin if it had something to do with the Word. I think he is being purified into something good like an angel? Perhaps angels are just people who have done well in heaven and are not 'beings' created by God. Just rambling on here
I'd forgotten that Cas doesn't know about the bat cave. I just feel so bad for poor Cas who is once again all alone trying to save the world. Also the one person whom he was REALLY hiding from was friggin Crowley (and here I was thinking and hoping that he would see the light one day eventually, turn all soft and help Dean and Sam) and he is the one person who ends up with it. AAARGH!! Unless of course that Cas has gone and duplicated it and put it back where they found it!! hope hope hope
Oh and I like your thought on duplicating the tablet ( I don't think that's the case since he had the other one hidden inside of him) but I like the idea! Cas screwing over Crowley and then re-hiding the tablet from makind, the angels and demons...Seems like a very Cas like thing to do.
Also, if anyone goes to Comic-Con, ask Carver about the Grand Canyon blooper and do it with love.
I am now wondering about the trials though. I mean closing the gates of hell requires three trials; killing a hellhound, saving a soul from hell and curing a demon. The first two are related as Sam needed to have hellhound blood to get into hell undetected (that's my take on it anyway), and the person he had to rescue was Bobby. So I am sure the last trial, curing a demon, has got to be connected to the other two. I have a feeling that it has to do with Bobby and that he needed to get to heaven (apart from the fact that he wasn't meant to be in hell in the first place) for the third trial to be completed. The reason that Crowley had him thrown him into hell is that he knew something about Bobby's part in the third trial (remember he had the other half of the tablet). So I think that there is a demon in heaven who needs to be cured... Naomi perhaps? Maybe her brain has also been tampered with, not sure about this though.
At this stage I feel that Naomi has done some tampering with my brain too as there has been so much to hold onto plot wise that I feel like my head is going to explode. What do you think?
This leads to the questions of how many demons do we actually know about that are still alive? Azazel and Meg are both (presumably) dead. Crowley may be a live demon, but that's currently under debate, and I am not sure that the PTB would be willing to let this most awesome of big bad's go just yet. The most likely person at this point could be Adam... he's been in the pit for 3 years (4 if you include the "missing" year) which is like 360-480 years hell time; more than enough to make Adam into a demon. There's also Abbadon, and they basically have her in captivity... but I'd like the demon they cure to be more meaningful to them than her... the brother's feel no obligation to help Abbadon. They could locate some previously unknown demon, but that wouldn't hold the dramatic weight of them attempting to cure a demon that has history in the show like Meg. I like the idea of Adam best, but who knows if Jake Abel was even available; and I haven't heard a peep about it... if he'd been back we most surely would have heard something through the grapevine, that kind of a casting secret is hard to keep.
The demon cure thing is a bit of a mind-bender isn't it?