I literally stepped through the door two minutes ago from vacation, just in time to get this posted.  So how was "Dark Side of The Moon?"  I'll join you all in an hour with my thoughts. 


# Ardeospina 2010-04-01 22:12
Wow, that was epic. And flipping awesome! Man, I can't wait to watch that one again. Except I might have to wait a while because the end was just so heartbreaking.
# Sablegreen 2010-04-01 22:24
I don't think this will rank high on my list of re-watches. I'll have to say, I was disappointed.

Loved Ash and Pamela, and loved that that boys are making life miserable for Zach.

Brothers vs brothers is not my cup of tea. Won't say what I think about what they did with the amulet. So glad I had people watch it last week instead of this week.

Will be interested in what you all thought.
# Stephanie 2010-04-01 22:30
Wow... please, Sammy... get it out of the trash!! That last scene is definitely going to stay with me.

On a more up note.. Michael Shanks is in next week's ep. Having my three favorite men all on one screen might make me spontaneously combust from the utter joy! :-)
# AndreaW 2010-04-01 22:31
This was one of the saddest endings in the entire series, right there with Good God Y'All and When The Levee Breaks. It was even worse than the boys' death endings, because nothing can be more heatbreaking than brother x brother, like Sablegreen said. :cry::
# Rose 2010-04-01 22:37
Loved this episode but the ending? Wow, so depressing. I feel like pulling a Dean and downing a six pack!
# Alice 2010-04-01 23:08
Wow, I'm so stunned! This episode is brilliant. VERY sad, but it's got some amazing character continuity from "My Bloody Valentine." Remember how broken Dean was after that? He had no fight left in him. All those fears, all those doubts, they all surfaced here and he can't overcome them.

Dean is losing faith in Sam. He certainly couldn't have faith in him after watching him in "My Bloody Valentine." That devastated him. All that was left was God, just like Joshua said. I'm not only heartbroken for Dean, but for Sam as well, who had no idea what was happening with Dean. This was the answer to Dean's plea for help. How tragic. Poor Cas too. He did it all for nothing.

I'm going to rewatch several times. There's so much to analyze here. I'm not worried, because remember the brothers and Cas have to hit rock bottom in order to rise up. The final six episodes are going to be intense.
# AndreaW 2010-04-01 23:24
The amulet!! Sam totally has to pick it up from trash and re-offer it to his brother at the end. Please, writers, please!!
Dean and little Sam. That was SO beautiful. Loved it. The way little Sam hugs Dean and the way Dean reacts to it. Adorable. Colin Ford rocks. :-)
# Alice 2010-04-01 23:28
Now that I've absorbed this more, this isn't brother vs. brother. "When The Levee Breaks" was brother vs. brother. Sam wants to be there, to fight with Dean, to help. He was just blindsided here, since he hasn't seen Dean's faith waiver so far. He was after all detoxing when Dean had his meltdown.

Dean is at his lowest of lows and needs to work this out on his own. Have faith everyone. The brothers will find each other again.
# Alice 2010-04-02 00:21
Dean: Your heaven is somebody’s else’s Thanksgiving. It’s bailing on your family. What do you want me to say?
Sam: Man, I never got the crusts cut off my PB and J, I just don’t look at family the way you do.
Dean: Yeah but I’m your family. We’re supposed to be a team. Just you and me against the world.
Sam: It is.
Dean: Is it?

Wow. Such a parallel in that Heaven is the way you see things. Dean is seeing his growing lack of faith in Sam. I'm sure Randal won't think the garden in Heaven is the Cleveland Botanical Gardens though!
# Antoinette 2010-04-02 00:48
I'm so tired of Sam apologizing for seeking self-actualizat ion when younger. And tired of Dean for crapping on him about it.
# Supernarttu 2010-04-02 02:03
Wow. Just. Wow.

I can't say anything before I watch it again...and again... and again.. And I'm not sure if I want to.

Can you say: Heartbreaking?

Oh Man.

The end of this season is going to kill me :/
# Faellie 2010-04-02 02:33
"I wuv hugs"? Dean would so not be safe wearing that T-shirt.

This episode had me transfixed all the way through. Stunningly good, and so much in it. It's surely going to be the episode most mentioned in meta, ever.
# Bethany 2010-04-02 03:25
i love the fireworks moment - i'll admit i teared up it was just an amazing moment.

I get why sam would see those moments of independance as good memories and why dean would hate them, neither of them are seeing it from the others point of view. but for dean there are only so many hits he can take and finding out that some of the worst moments of your life were for the most important person in your life good memories that's got to be a blow that would leave him reeling.

oh and i hope sam takes the amulet out of the trash. I'm sure dean'll want it back.

final note - my heart ached when sam told dean "i didn't realise how long you've been cleaning up dad's messes for" oh dean, always the one holding his family together even when he was three or four.
# anene 2010-04-02 04:08
I understand you Antoinette but i think you could also look at it as more as it's not that Sam should be sorry about seeking self-actualizat ion, but more like understanding that the choices we make in life whether intentional or innocent, there are consequences that arise such as in this case, hurting Dean. Sam never ever will hurt Dean intentionally but considering the kind of relationship they share where their lives are so intertwined, there was bound to be a sense of betrayal and hurt when one does something excluding the other. I've been in Sam's place countless of times. I've said something very innocent like "oh you're back" and my friend took it to mean i didn't want her there. I was shocked but totally could see how it came to be about. Miscommunicatio n is Sam & Dean's problem right now.

And Dean is just feeling extremely wounded. Sure he was hurt that Sam could go off on his own because it was inconceivable to Dean that a family could be apart physically and still love each other. But the parallel of the fraction of Sam's heaven memories (which were totally justified and made total sense)coincidin g with being Dean's hellish moments is the catalyst to Dean losing faith in Sam's love for him. He can't fathom how Sam could see a heaven(any at all) where he wasn't in it. After all, his question to Castiel was "if this is heaven, where is Sam?"

They are both right and both wrong at the same time. They are soulmates after all(cannon by the way) and will find their way to each other after coming clean. I will bleed alongside them till then.
# Julie 2010-04-02 05:39
98 episodes and I really didnt think this show could effect me any more than it has done with some past episodes, for me AAH springs to mind.
I was so wrong.
I know I need to, but part of me feels like never waching this one again, I will because it was brilliant, everything, the writing, directing and acting, Oh God the acting, were all what we have come to expect, but the sheer raw emotion of this one has just blown me away.One of the most powerful hours of tv I have ever seen.
I am at a loss for words. Kripke is a Genius.
# Scullspeare 2010-04-02 07:19
Wow, gut-wrenching indeed.

De-lurking to chip in that Zach is…well, there are words for him not fit for polite company. But Kurt Fuller – you’re awesome!

First, Zach sets up Dean with that beautiful little memory of young Sam and the fireworks, and that simple, ordinary (yet extraordinary for Dean) moment with his Mom in the kitchen. Then, he cherry-picks moments from Sam’s childhood that can alternately be seen as ‘selfish’ or ‘tantalizingl y normal’ depending on whose eyes they’re seen through, and mines that two-lane through Heaven with them, knowing they’ll detonate an emotionally spent Dean’s insecurities.

From Sam’s side of things, how heartbreaking was the look on JP’s face when Sam first sees his mom, then watches her in the kitchen with Dean? Then, as Dean fights to stay a little longer in the memory – and who can blame him for wanting some maternal comfort given the emotional tailspin he’s in – Sam’s says pointedly, “I never had anyone to cut the crusts off my PB&J.” Gah!

Loved, too, Sam’s realization that Dean had been cleaning up their ‘Dad’s messes’ since he was little. And JA was stellar in that scene where he comforts their Mom after the phone fight with John. It was a mesmerizing mix of the grown man Dean is and the little boy he was.

Oh, but Zach isn’t done, proving he can out-sick and out-twist even Alistair by turning Mary against Dean. Then God turns his back on him… or so we’re led to believe. Just as well Dean ‘Wuvs Hugz’ because that poor boy sure could use one.

My breath caught when Dean dropped the amulet in the trash can but, to me, that had everything to do with God and very little to do with Sam. I KNOW Sam picked it up and we’ll see it again – it just won’t be for a while. *sniff*
# MyMADWorld 2010-04-02 08:28
Good catch, Anene. Dean's best memories were of Sam and his mom but he didn't even make it into Sam's best memories. And his comment - if this is heaven where's Sam says a lot. Notice Dad didn't make it into either of their best memories - probably because JDM wasn't available - but also because of the way he was.
How come Hell isn't a series of their worst nightmares? Dean reliving the fire or the time Sam took off over and over would have been a pretty horrible hell. He probably would have preferred the torture.
# Jeannine 2010-04-02 08:39
Ow. owww. That was heartbreaking.

Ash was awesome. String theory in heaven. Interesting that Ash can't find John Winchester though. Where's John?

Sam and Dean's memories are a fanfic writers gold mine. The way Dean said how their dad reacted when he got home and Sam had been missing gave me chills. I got the feeling that John's reaction wasn't the normal appropriate parental response. And that whole scene with the fireworks...wib ble. Sam's reaction with his dog, anyone else see a bit of Jared there? :-)

Kripke's idea of heaven is disturbing. Very.

Zachariah is...a lot of things I can't say here. I honestly can't see the difference between him and demons. Especially when he kissed Mary's neck. Oh that was so wrong. I wanted to reach into the TV and punch him in the face.

I feel like I'm just scratching the surface on this episode. There are hints and subtle reveals througout and I'm just going to have to rewatch. But there is no doubt that Sam took the amulet out of the garbage and we will see it again.
# AndreaW 2010-04-02 09:29
"If I'm in Heaven where is Sam?" I have a different interpretation for this one. Given Sam's "service record" and Deans's concerned reaction, I think Dean was afraid that this brother could be somewhere else, like Hell.

PS: Sam and the dog was completely adorable. I love it how they played with Jared's love for animals.
# elle2 2010-04-02 09:46
I thought it was brilliant!

I have had concerns in the past with this writing duo, notably Yellow Fever parts, but all in all this was excellent -- and these two writers have consistently exceeded my expectations. I enjoy how much they mine the back story for their plots and in this they gave us some marvelous insights into both Dean and Sam and set up much of the future conflict/divide between them.

Very clearly it was shown where Dean's devotions/chara cterization is framed from and where Sam's is; not that this is new information but it is excellently laid out here.

I love how Sam is so autonomous in his thought subconscious, a Thanksgiving, an apartment and dog, the time he left for Stamford and how Dean is so family oriented, young Sam and him stealing away and 'violating' dad's rules by firing off rockets; how Sam brings out the kid in Dean, being there for mom and comforting her when he was too young to understand anything more than he loved mom and knew there was trouble.

It was devastating to see how cruelly 'mom' tore into Dean and no doubt Sam understood the depth of the destruction by what he'd witnessed in Dean's version of heaven. It didn't help that Dean similarly now understood the depth of Sam's mindset because the brothers have now been 'inside' each other's minds in ways they never have been before. No secrets here.

Was it manipulation by the angels? I don't think so, while I mistrusted Pamela as she seemed to be pushing Dean to say yes, and wondered if this was another trick by Zach, Ash's reactions were true to character and very believable, as were Cas'. I don't believe this was a trick, I believe the brothers' reactions and inner secrets revealed were real.

The fact that they were granted the memories from this outing is satisfying to me as a viewer but devastating to the brothers and the end which killed me -- dropping of the amulet into the trash can -- was spot on for what had transpired in the episode. Sam's devastation as he watched Dean's action was palpable and I firmly hope he grabbed that amulet up with him for a more appropriate time in the future.

I know many will not like this latest tear in the brothers but I believe it's simply the continuation of what began long ago, they've never fully made it back but they're trying, it's gonna take more than some shared fights against evil to find a solid ground.

I do note the slightly out of step arrangement of these episodes and for a moment could wish that they had aired in their original order with Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid before My Bloody Valentine and then Dark Side of the Moon, timing is everything though and I 'forgive' the reordering. However, the sequence from My Bloody Valentine's ending with Dean praying to a trip to heaven (which is an answer to a prayer of some sorts as it appears God sent them a message via Joshua) makes for a smoother transition, but now having seen them and able to reflect on more of the whole than before eases the perceived out of sequenceness of the episodes.

This has been a season of excellent character development and I have no idea where it goes from here but based on some of the releases from the CW regarding the 100th episode it is much easier to understand why Dean will be contemplating what he contemplates there; after all, he realizes everyone does leave him, and even the one that is still there inwardly wants to be elsewhere. Sometimes that kind of knowledge is best left unknown.
# Karen 2010-04-02 10:12
Once again visited by Doom and Gloom.
And to think 6 more episodes of the same.

Looks like things are taking its tow with the aftermath of MBV, the motel room full of empty beer cans and bottles, a sign that things are not going well emotionally for our brothers.
Seeing Dean throwing away the amulet and having his last thread of hope break while Sam desperately clings to his, it just breaks my heart.
I don’t think I’m going to survive to the season finale.

I have to agree with Skullspears (btw welcome to the site), I believe the memory parts were orchestrated by Zack. Another attempt to destroy Sam and Dean’s spirit and put a wedge between their relationship. After all they will never say yes if they are still a strong team.
As for Ash and Pamela, I’m not sure…Ash seemed genuine but Pamela seemed a bit orchestrated. I will have to think that one more.

I also agree with Antoinette, that Sam should not have to apologize for wanting a life outside of the hunting world. He never liked it and it seems he always made that clear.
However I do understand Dean’s reaction, his feeling of betrayal and rejection. Dean was the one who raised Sam, devoted his whole life to him. He took Sam running away on his watch and going off to Stanford personally. He didn’t see it was their father and the life style that Sam was turning his back on, but that it was from him.

However through all this Doom and Gloom….that firecracker scene was beautiful and heartwarming… I just loved it…I was also teary watching it.
# Randal 2010-04-02 10:20
No, Alice, that was not the Cleveland Botanical Gardens. :D

Kurt Fuller, A+. He's always sold the slimy politician side of being a dickhead angel, but here, stone cold pimp. What a first rank asshole.

Ash the Mexican wrestler! And being the brainiac that he is, finding his way around the infinite realms of heaven, which, unsurprisingly given the SPN world, is one more place that's completely not about choice. Dean's right: it *is* the Matrix. Once again, the only place in this crazy existence that is real, that is about choice, isn't the infinite permutation of axis mundi, but the flawed planet earth.

So Pam is a Deangirl, heh. Even her happy (I too, thought, and still think a bit, of an angelic manipulation) but Dean is adamantly, and rightly so, on the side of humanity, of choice.

Loved Cas on the TV, so redolent of 1984, which is what heaven, IMO, mirrors quite well. We've always been at war with Eastasia, we've always been happy. And some of those happy moments were beautiful, the fireworks scene above all. I can see where some might think the handling was a bit heavy-handed (Dean is only about Beaver Cleaver family stuff, Sam is only about being on his own, etc, etc,) but these are the dominant subconscious workings. And lest we forget, young Sam WAS happy and WAS very thankful for his brother. "Dad would never let us do this."

Great to see Cas become a thematic bookened; he's where Dean (and to a lesser extent, Sam) was. Last year, Dean was the one trying to hold everything together as their world unraveled. Now it's going to be Sam's turn, Sam, the "dark" half of this yin and yang. A tinge of the retribution, methinks.

The amulet was for nothing? Certainly not. It's still an emblem of their brotherly relationship and one can say it served its purpose. God, through Joshua, was found. And kudos to that actor (can't remember his name), really sold the near-ennui of having tried and failed. I believe he truly does sympathize. And frankly, I think it makes sense that the Big Cheese is an absentee father.

Now it's time for Sam, the one who ostensibly started this (we all know it's more complex than that) to pick that necklace up and push forward and tell Dean (and now, Cas) that they may go down, but they'll be going down swinging. Sam was in that dark place, now Dean is, and one always helps the other.
# Randal 2010-04-02 10:26
Sorry for the double, but after seeing Karen's comment on a comment, I must comment.

I share the idea of Zachariah getting his manipulation on, especially with Mary, but I think that's an angel-wide deal; outside of recent Cas developments (and, it, seems, Joshua, who lives the solitary life of a heavenly gardener and thus isn't swamped with their assholery 24/7), every angel has essentially been a dick. Who knows how long they've been greasing the wheels of heaven? Instead of a paradise (which, by definition, would have to include free will, because is that not mankind's gift?), it's been manipulated into a ice cream with sprinkles.

Probably getting too meta (I'd love to hear everyone else's take on the metaphysics of SPN's heaven), but Ash was able to break through this kabuki theatre. I can't imagine the original blueprint of heaven was reliving good memories at the expense of living.
# trina 2010-04-02 11:11
Just a few things. I don't think that was Pamela. She said she was shot and killed. Pamela was stabbed in "Death Takes a Holiday". Also, she was pretty heavy on the say yes to Michael theme. She just felt wrong.

I do like the idea that Sam is the one who needs to hold everything together right now. Kripke has said Sam's story arc is redemtion, and it feels like this is where we are headed. I also don't see any way that Sam is going to say yes to Lucifer now, but Dean seems to be ever closer.
# Jasminka 2010-04-02 12:52
I really suffered through this episode, a) because it came in a very bad quality online and hang itself up every few minutes, b) because it tore through my heart with a blade of the size of Texas, I guess. This was utterly sad, and since I came back from my trip exhausted and mostly devastatingly sad (I was so happy during those days that I had to hit rock bottom sooner or later - God does not allow happiness to last long, at least not on my planet), this episode was a mean gut-punch.
That Dean was losing hope is not new, and Sam struggles to keep it up, but now Castiel is losing it too - the day when they will say Yes draws nearer, I guess.
What Dean did with the amulet - in his place, in his state of mind I would have done exactly the same.

Lots of love to y'all, guys! Jas
# magichappening 2010-04-02 15:03
Just re-watched it and damn. Ouch. Amazing, but ouch. There is so much in each scene. But just to pick up on the end, three questions:

1. What was the motive behind Joshua saying to Dean 'except you don't know if you can this time', particularly in front of Sam?

2. And what was the reason God wanted them to remember this time?

3. And finally what was the significance of Cas's long pause after saying 'I believed in...' and then saying he did not need the amulet any more?

Enquiring minds want to know.

NB Joshua translates into English as Jesus and comes from the Hebrew which means Yahweh or salvation. Am just saying...
# Bevie 2010-04-02 15:33
This episode punched the air right out of me. The emotions it produced were utter joy with young Sam and Dean shooting off fireworks and Sam hugging his big brother and utter utter despair of poor Dean finding out that Sam's best memories do not involve him at all! I hurt so much for Dean as we know his abandonment issues are huge (and who could blame him).

Since Dean and Cass are now completely devastated I can only hope that Sam will keep the small flame of hope burning and convey some of that to them.

And devastated was what I was when Dean dropped the amulet into the trash and the tears started, and every time I woke up in the night I thought of that and wibbled some more. I do long for the day when we can sense a glimmer of hope in this wonderful show.

Never did I imagine that Dean would trash his beloved amulet, but I guess that means he has completely lost faith in his brother as well as any heavenly beings. And poor poor Cas who has ended up with nothing after all the faith he previously had in his heavenly dad.

God, I hope Sam retrieves that amulet and keeps it until he is able to bestow it back to his beloved brother. I really wish Sam could have had a happy memory that included his brother for Dean to see, but I guess it all has to descend to rock bottom before it can begin to rise again.

What a great actor is Kurt Fuller, as he makes me detest and hate him with all my heart!

So happy to see Ash again. Hope we see him again. So he can't find BDW in heaven. Wonder if that fact is significant or just means JDM not being available.

Excellent excellent episode. It just broke my heart to little bits.
# Arkangelblue 2010-04-02 17:24
This was a brilliant epi, and I'm still trying to unravel all the different possibilities that could happen in the next episodes!!!

What I couldn't understand was Zachariah boasting about what he looks like in Heaven! Surely they where in Heaven so why the meat suit??? Don't quite understand why he would need to wear a meat suit in Heaven anyhow, but it did make me wonder if this was not really Heaven, but some complex plan by the Angels, like in 'It's a terrible life'?
# staceycp 2010-04-02 22:10
hey guys! hey alice! haven't posted in quite some time but I feel compelled to as I really loved this episode as I think it represents the best of supernatural. family/brotherh ood and the bond between the brothers.

It flowed so well and I think their are alot of people who are missing the messege of this episode and thinking its the same old brother conflict when I dont think it is either as I think this is the season where they are having to truly understand and know eachother.

coincidentally the same day the ep aired I was playing the adam lambert song 'what do you want from me' (I know the whole song is more romantically inclined but I aint refering to anything wincesty lol) I think the chorus really fitted this episode. as it was almost like sam and deans comments to eachother. Ill put down the chorus with dean or sam next to it which indicates their emotional state through the episode.

( Just don’t give up I’m workin it out (sam)
Please don’t give in, I won’t let you down (sam)
It messed me up, need a second to breathe (dean)
Just keep coming around (sam)
Hey, whataya want from me (sam)
Whataya want from me (sam)
Whataya want from me (sam))
# Narcissus 2010-04-03 04:43
The episode as whole was very sad, but it's not up there with the epics, if you ask me. On the other hand, the last 116 seconds alone must be the saddest 116 seconds in all tv history...Holy blessed trashcan!

I need to go curl up in a ball and cry now. Brb. :cry:: :cry:: :cry::
# Freebird 2010-04-03 06:53
What does "wuv" mean?
# Faellie 2010-04-03 07:39
Hi, Freebird

"wuv" is a babytalk version of "love". Even a four year old boy these days might not want to wear a T-shirt with "I wuv hugz" on it, but someone in heaven - unconciously, perhaps Dean himself? - seems to have thought it appropriate to Dean's memories of early childhood.
# Freebird 2010-04-03 07:50
Thank you, Faellie. I have a bunch of dictionaries at home, and there are the online dicts, too, but some things just cannot be found :-)
Just watched the epi, and took a quick look an the articles, yours included. Need a closer look though, when I get the time. But, so far, all I can say is that I loved the episode! Resurrection Supernatural-st yle :-)
Have a great Easter-weekend! !!